ASSEMBLY INSURANCE COMMITTEE
HEARING. JULY THIRTEENTH TWENTY
TWENTY ONE LOOKS LIKE WE HAVE A-
MORE THAN A QUORUM WHICH IS A
GOOD THING. WELL LET ME ASK THE
COMMITTEE SECRETARY TIFFANY TO
PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. DALY HERE
DALY HERE MAYES HERE MAYES HERE
BERMAN. BIGELOW YEAH BIGELOW
HERE CALDERON. CALDERON HERE
CHEN CHEN HERE COOLEY COOLEY
HERE COOPER COOPER HERE FRAZIER
FRAZIER HERE GIPSON GRAYSON.
GRAYSON HERE RODRIGUEZ
RODRIGUEZ HERE VOEPEL WHAT
WOULD HERE. GREAT CORMS BEEN
ESTABLISHED WITH ONE BILL ON
THE AGENDA FOR. SO. LET'S GET
UNDER WAY. MISTER VICE CHAIR
AND MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE
WELCOME TO OUR- ONE BILL
HEARING. PLEASE REMEMBER THE
MAST REQUIREMENT FOR EVERYONE
IN THIS ROOM IS IN EFFECT.
MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC CAN
PARTICIPATE IN TODAY'S HEARING
BY CALLING. 877-692-8957 THE
PASSCODE OF. ONE THREE ONE FIVE
FOUR THREE SEVEN. CAN ALSO
PARTICIPATE VIA THE REMOTE
TESTIMONY STATION ON THE NORTH
STEPS OF THE CAPITOL OR IN
PERSON. CORMS BEEN ESTABLISHED
SO THE SUBJECT TO THE HEARING
TODAY IS SB THREE THIRTY FIVE
BY SENATOR CORTEZ HE- HI I SEE
THAT HE'S HERE- THE BILL MAKES
SEVERAL CHANGES TO THE WORKERS
COMPENSATION SYSTEM IN THE
PUBLIC AND PRIVATE SECTORS
INCLUDING LOWERING THE TIME
PERIOD AN EMPLOYER HAS TO
REJECT LIABILITY FOR AN INJURY.
INCREASING THE AMOUNT OF
MEDICAL TREATMENT THE EMPLOYER
MUST IMMEDIATELY AUTHORIZED FOR
AN ALLEGED INJURY. AND CHANGING
THE PENALTY STRUCTURE FOR
PRESUMPTIVE INJURIES. I AM
EMPATHETIC TO THE AUTHORS
CONCERNS IN REGARDS TO CLAIMS
BY FIREFIGHTERS AND PUBLIC
SAFETY OFFICERS FOR PRESUMPTIVE
INJURIES THAT ARE DENIED. WHICH
IS WHY MY RECOMMENDED
AMENDMENTS WOULD PROVIDE A
MODERATE INCREASE IN PENALTIES
FOR UNREASONABLE DENIALS. THE
COMMITTEE ANALYSIS HAS FOR
RECOMMENDED AMENDMENTS ONE OF
THOSE AMENDMENTS DEALS WITH THE
PENALTY AMOUNT. CONSIDERATION
WAS TAKEN INTO THE FACT THAT
THE PENALTY AMOUNT HAS NOT BEEN
CHANGED SINCE TWO THOUSAND AND
FOUR AND A MODERATE INCREASE TO
THE CAP IS REASONABLE AND
RECOGNIZES CHANGES IN INFLATION
AND THE COST OF LIVING. WITHOUT
MORE EVIDENCE OR DATA A LARGER
PENALTY. IN MY OPINION IS NOT
PRUDENT ESPECIALLY SINCE THESE
PENALTIES ARE PAID BY PUBLIC
ENTITIES WITH TAXPAYER DOLLARS.
TO ALLOW THIS MEASURE TO MOVE
FORWARD AND CONTINUE
DISCUSSIONS IT'S RECOMMENDED WE
ADOPT THE COMMITTEE AMENDMENTS
REFLECTED IN THE COMMITTEE
ANALYSIS ON PAGE SIX AND SEVEN.
THERE FOR AMENDMENTS. NUMBER
ONE DELETE ALL THE PROVISIONS
OF THE BILL EXCEPT FOR THE
PENALTY PROVISION. THAT NUMBER
TO THE PENALTY PROVISION OF THE
BILL WOULD APPLY TO PRESUMPTIVE
INJURIES CLAIMED BY
FIREFIGHTERS AND PUBLIC SAFETY
OFFICERS THAT WOULD APPLY WHEN
AN EMPLOYER ON REASONABLY
DENIES LIABILITY FOR A CLAIM.
IF AN APPEALS BOARD JUDGE
DETERMINES THAT THE DENIAL OF
LIABILITY WAS ON REASONABLE.
THE PENALTY WILL BE 25% OF THE
DENIED BENEFITS FOR TWENTY FIVE
THOUSAND WHICHEVER IS LESS.
THESE AMENDMENTS WOULD ONLY
APPLY TO PUBLIC EMPLOYERS
BECAUSE THE PENALTY WOULD ONLY
BE AVAILABLE. TO FIREFIGHTERS
AND PUBLIC SAFETY OFFICERS WITH
PRESUMPTIVE INJURIES. WELCOME
MR VOEPEL TO ROUGH I THINK WE
HAVE A FULL HOUSE NOW. HERE ON
THE COMMITTEE SO- IT WILL BE
HELPFUL TO HAVE A MOTION ON
THOSE FOR COMMITTEE AMENDMENTS
MISTER CHAIR I MOVE THE BILL TO
PASS AS AMENDED IS PROPOSING
COMMITTEE ANALYSIS. THANK YOU.
THERE'S A MOTION AND SECOND-
OKAY. AT THIS POINT THOSE
AMENDMENTS ARE ON THE TABLE ALL
INVITE SENATOR CORTEZ THE TO
COME UP IN THE PRESENT HIS BILL.
WELCOME TO ASSEMBLY INSURANCE
SIR. THANK YOU MISTER CHAIR
THANK YOU MISTER MEMBERS- IN
APPRECIATE OF THE WARM WELCOME
IT WILL CERTAINLY EXTEND THE
SAME TO ALL OF YOU. WHEN YOU
HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY COME INTO
THE SENATE LABOR COMMITTEE- I
WANT TO START OFF BY THANKING
THEM THE CHAIR AND COMMITTEE
STAFF FOR THEIR TIRELESS WORK
AND CONTINUE THE EFFORT- TO GET
TO A HAPPY MEDIUM ON THE BILL I
DON'T DISAGREE WITH- THE
DESCRIPTION OF COURSE- THAT THE
CHURCH IS PROVIDED IN TERMS OF.
OF WHERE WE'RE AT- I'M HERE TO
PRESENT SB THREE THIRTY FIVE
WHICH I THINK IS A COMMON SENSE
MEASURE THAT WOULD SEEK TO
REDUCE. AND DETER UNREASONABLE
DENIALS ON WORKERS COMPENSATION
CLAIMS AND AS CHAIR JUST
INDICATED- WE'RE TALKING ABOUT
PRESUMPTIVE WORKERS
COMPENSATION COMPENSATION
CLAIMS WITH THESE PUBLIC SAFETY
OFFICERS. ONLY AND- THOSE OF
PENALTIES THAT WE'RE DISCUSSING
ARE ONLY AFTER A JUDGE HAS
ADJUDICATED- THAT THERE'S BEEN
AN UNREASONABLE DENIAL OF THE
CLAIM IN THE FIRST PLACE AND I
THINK THAT'S PIVOTAL IN THIS
DISCUSSION. A IN THE NOW THE
BILL BEFORE THE COMMITTEE
OUTLINES FOR PROPOSED
AMENDMENTS THAT WERE JUST. A
DISCUSSED- BASED ON THE
CONVERSATIONS WITH THE CHAIR
AND- OTHER MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE- I'M WILLING TO TAKE
AMENDMENTS ONE AND TWO AS
OUTLINED IN THE ANALYSIS- AND
WE MADE THAT CLEAR FOR SOME
TIME. UNFORTUNATELY I HAVE TO
REJECT THE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS
THREE AND FOUR AS OUTLINED IN
THE ANALYSIS WHICH DEAL WITH.
BUT THE SPECIFIC. PENALTY
PROVISIONS. FOUND IN THE BILL.
THOSE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS WOULD
HAVE NO MEASURABLE IMPACT WOULD
NOT PROVIDE THE RELIEF THAT OUR
PUBLIC SAFETY EMPLOYEES NEED
AND DESERVE. 55% BASED ON
REPUBLIC DATA THAT YOU COULD
GOOGLE WHILE YOU'RE LISTENING
TO ME 55% OF THESE CLAIMS ARE
BETWEEN TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS
TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS A TWENTY
THOUSAND DOLLARS. ALL RIGHT.
BUT THE CURRENT STATUTE. WOULD
CALL CALLS 410% PENALTY AFTER
AND REASONABLE DENIAL. A
REASONABLE DONALD IT'S BEEN
ADJUDICATED THAT'S TWO HUNDRED
BUCKS ON A TWO THOUSAND DOLLAR
CLAIM THAT WAS WRITTEN RECENTLY
WITHHELD IS NOT A DETERRENT TO
ANYTHING. WE THINK ALTHOUGH IT
SOUNDS LIKE A BIG INCREASE TO
GO FROM 10% 225% THAT. A FIVE
HUNDRED DOLLAR PENALTY ON THAT
SAME TWO THOUSAND DOLLAR CLAIM
ISN'T MUCH OF A DETERRENT
EITHER. AND THAT'S WHY WE'VE
BEEN ARRESTED WITH THE MATH
TRYING TO COME UP WITH. WHAT IS
THE RIGHT NUMBER TO DEFER TO
THE TURF EFFECTIVELY DETER
FOLKS FROM TAKING ADVANTAGE. OF
URBAN APPEAL SYSTEM- ON THESE
CLAIMS- AGAIN 5055% A MAJORITY
OF WHICH ARE BELOW TWENTY
THOUSAND DOLLARS- AS I OFFERED
THE COMMITTEE. I AM I WOULD
ABSOLUTELY BE WILLING TO A MAN
AND A COMPROMISE PROPOSAL- AN
AMENDMENT THAT WOULD CREATE A
PENALTY. OF FIVE TIMES THE
AMOUNT OF THE BENEFITS OF
REASONABLY TONIGHT BUT IN NO
CASE IN EXCESS OF FIFTY
THOUSAND DOLLARS. IF YOU'RE
WONDERING WHERE THE REST OF THE
CLAIMS GO IN TERMS OF DOLLAR
AMOUNTS THE HIGHEST CLEAN WE
KNOW OF ON THE RECORD. IS TEN
MILLION DOLLARS. SO WITH THE
ONE HAND I YOU SAY TWENTY FIVE
THOUSAND DOLLARS IS THE CAP. ON
A MILLION DOLLAR A FIVE MILLION
DOLLAR TEN MILLION ARE CLAIMED
NOT MUCH OF A DETERRENT THERE
BUT WE THINK THE FIFTY THOUSAND
DOLLAR. CAP IS MUCH MORE
APPROPRIATE. OTHER THAN THE
TWENTY FIVE THOUSAND THAT'S
BEEN THAT'S BEEN SUGGESTED. I
KNOW THAT THE CHAIR AND I BOTH
AGREE AND WE DISCUSSED AND
APPRECIATE THE DISCUSSIONS THAT
IT IS. IN EVERYONE'S BEST
INTEREST HERE- TO. TO CREATE A
DETERRENT- TO THE UNREASONABLE
DENIAL OF THESE CLAIMS- BUT
AGAIN I THINK OF THE MATH TELLS
US- THAT- THERE'S NOT MUCH OF A
DETERRENT IF WE KEEP THOSE
DOLLAR AMOUNTS TO VOTE. BUT I
WILL SAY THAT. THE DATA ON THE
NATURE OF THESE DENIALS. SIMPLY
IS NOT COLLECTED. WE KNOW THE
DOLLAR AMOUNTS ON A CLAIMS AND
WHAT THE- THE ROUGH AVERAGES
ARE- AND WERE TOLD THAT THE
ROUGH AVERAGE. OVERALL IS ABOUT
TWENTY THOUSAND DOLLARS- TO
ADDRESS THAT ISSUE I'M ALSO
COMMITTED ADELINE ADDIE
LANGUAGE TO REQUIRE THAT
PENALTIES ISSUED. BE REPORTED
TO THE AUDIT UNIT OF THE
DIVISION OF WORKERS
COMPENSATION. THAT WAY WE CAN
START COLLECTING DATA ON WHAT'S
REALLY HAPPENING IN TERMS
QUANTITATIVELY IN TERMS OF HOW
MANY- AND REASONABLY DECIDE AND
WHAT THE ACTUAL PENALTIES ARE
THAT ARE BEING ASSESSED WELL
THIS IS NOT ONE OF THE PROPOSED
AMENDMENTS IN THE ANALYSIS ITS
DELIVERY ISSUE. RAISED BY THE
DISTRIBUTION. DYER'S MARKETS
YEAH VERY MUCH APPRECIATE. GAP
IN DATA THAT NEEDS TO BE FIXED
DOES NEED FIXING. HER TO
TESTIFY WITH ME TODAY ARE BRIAN
RICE PRESENT. FIREFIGHTERS THE
PHOENIX OVER HEALTHCARE WORKERS
COMPENSATION JUDGE. VERY MUCH
APPRECIATE YOUR ATTENTION. THE
I RESPECTFULLY- PURCHASE A
REASONABLE FOR YEAH THANK YOU
VERY MUCH SENATOR I'M- MISTER
RICE THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR
A TESTIMONY PLEASE GO AHEAD.
THANK YOU MY FRIEND REYES AND
THE PRESIDENT OF CALIFORNIA
PROFESSIONAL FIREFIGHTERS I DID
MY FIRE SERVICE CAREER- RIGHT
HERE IN SACRAMENTO. IS NOTED BY
SEN CORTESE WILD SOME OF THE
AMENDMENTS BY THE TO MEDIA
WORKABLE. WE'RE HAVING THIS
BILL. WHILE WE WORK TO REVISE
THE PENALTIES IN A MANNER
THAT'S CONSISTENT WITH THE
LANGUAGE PUT FORWARD BY THE
AUTHOR. THAT PROPOSAL WILL
PRESERVE THE ABILITY OF THIS
BILL TO TACKLE UNREASONABLE
DENIALS. IN THE WORKERS
COMPENSATION SYSTEM.
REGRETTABLY THE PROPOSAL PUT
FORWARD BY THE COMMITTEE UNDER
BULLET THREE IN THE PROPOSED
AMENDMENTS ON PAGE SEVEN. THE
ANALYSIS WILL CONTINUE THE
STATUS QUO AND MY MEMBERS WILL
CONTINUE TO EXPERIENCE THE
DENIALS OTHER PRESUMPTIVE
CLAIMS. WORKERS COMPENSATION
PRESUMPTIVE'S THEIR INVALUABLE
PROTECTION FOR FIREFIGHTERS-
PARAMEDICS EMTS POLICE OFFICERS
PUBLIC SWORN PUBLIC SAFETY
OFFICERS. AND OTHER WORKERS WHO
JABR WHOSE JOBS ARE INHERENTLY
DANGEROUS INCOME WITH MORE
PERSONAL RISK. REMARKABLY
FIREFIGHTERS DON'T EXPERIENCE
THAT IT KNOWLEDGE MEANT NOR DO
POLICE OFFICERS NOTED
PARAMEDICS NOR DO EMTS WHEN
DEALING WITH THE PRESUMPTIVE
ILLNESS OR INJURY. IT'S MORE
COMMON NOW FOR EMPLOYER THEIR
INSURER OR THIRD PARTY
ADMINISTRATOR IN THE CASE OF
MANY SELF INSUREDS. TO
INITIALLY DENY A PRESUMPTIVE
CLAIM FACING NO MATERIAL RISK
OF INCURRING PENALTIES IF THE
CLAIM IS ULTIMATELY ACCEPTED
INJURED FIREFIGHTERS AND THEIR
FAMILIES. ARE CARRYING THE
PHYSICAL AND EMOTIONAL COST OF
AND REASONABLE DENIALS. AND
THEY ARE BEING ASKED TO SPREAD
SPEND THEIR TIME FIGHTING THEIR
ILLNESS IN THE SYSTEM AND IN
MANY CASES TO WHAT END. AS THE
AUTHOR PROPOSES TO AMEND THIS
BILL WOULD RESTRUCTURE THE
PENALTIES FOR UNREASONABLE
DENIAL OF LIABILITY FOR
PRESUMPTIVE INJURY CLAIM TO
ENSURE. THAT PENALTIES ARE REAL
DETRIMENT A TURRET INSTEAD OF
JUST THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS
OR AN AMOUNT THAT IS
IRRELEVANT- IN THE CASE OF A
PENALTY IF IT'S EVEN FILED AT
ALL. I URGE YOU TO SUPPORT SB
THREE THIRTY FIVE AND CENTER
CORTESE. AND I'M GONNA LEAVE
YOU WITH THIS- I'VE DONE THIS
FOR A LOT OF YEARS. IN IN THE
LAST TWO DECADES THE SYSTEM HAS
FIGURED OUT HOW TO DELAY. AND
IN SOME CASES NOT A WORD A
PRESUMPTIVE OR NOT EVEN
RECOGNIZE IT AND SO AS YOU
DEBATE AND YOU CONSIDER THIS I
WANT YOU TO CONSIDER. KIM
ANGELO- I PERSONALLY DOCUMENTED
TWO DECADES OF OVER FIFTEEN
KNOWN CARCINOGENIC- SUBSTANCES
IN EXPOSURES HUNDREDS. KIM DID
NOT. SHE DID NOT SHE WAS NOT OF
SHE HAD A BREAST CANCER SIMPLE
BREAST CANCER IN HEARING HER
TERMS SHE WAS NOT AWARDED A
PRESUMPTIVE INJURY STATUS SHE
WAS COMPENSATED BUT SHE COULD
SHE CAN GET IT THE OTHER ONE
RIGHT HERE IN SACRAMENTO MATT
BARRETT I SAT WITH YOU IN HIS
WIFE LORI. DOWNTOWN WELL WE HAD
TO LISTEN TO THE THIRD PARTY
ADMINISTRATORS. NOT BRING ANY
EVIDENCE. NOT BRING ANY
EMPIRICAL DATA ON THE CANCER
THAT HE CONTRACTED TRACTOR. TO
REFUTE IT FROM BEING JOB CAUSED
BACK ALMOST MATT DID DIE AND HE
BARELY. LIVED TO SEE HIS CASE
AWARDED. RIGHT NOW WHAT I'M
ASKING YOU IS REALLY SIMPLE.
AND SORRY ABOUT THAT IT'S HARD
TO BREATHE- IT'S TIME TO QUIT
PROTECTING THE INSURANCE
COMPANIES THE THIRD PARTY
ADMINISTRATORS AND START
PROTECTING YOUR FIREFIGHTERS IN
YOUR POLICE OFFICERS AND YOUR
EMTS AND YOUR PARAMEDICS WHO
ARE OUT ON THE FRONT LINES
RIGHT NOW AS I SPEAK. THE
SYSTEM IS FIGURED OUT A WAY TO
SHORT CIRCUIT WHAT WAS A VERY
GOOD LAW WHEN IT WENT INTO
PLACE IN THE SYSTEM RIGHT NOW
IS PROTECTING THE PROFIT. EVERY
ONE OF THOSE EVERY ONE OF THOSE
MEN AND WOMEN RIGHT NOW WE'RE A
DOLLAR SIGN IN THE DEBIT PILE.
PERIOD AND I'M ASKING YOU TO
CHANGE THAT THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
THANK YOU MISTER RICE- MISTER
DUDLEY PHOENIX. FORMER JUDGE
THE WORKERS COMP SYSTEM PLEASE
GO AHEAD SIR RIGHT- CHECK OF A
LIE THE WAY OF TWO MINUTES SIR
OKAY I'LL TRY TO MAKE IT AS
SUCH GERMAN DAILY IN MEMBERS OF
THE COMMITTEE THANKS VERY MUCH
FOR HEARING ME OUT- I'VE BEEN
IN WORKERS COMP FOR OVER THIRTY
ONE YEARS- OF THE FIRST SIXTEEN
YEARS I WAS IN OUT THIS
ATTORNEY FOCUSED ON PUBLIC
SAFETY CASES FIREFIGHTERS C. H.
B. AND THAT AND THOSE SORTS OF
EMPLOYEES. I THEN BECAME A
JUDGE FOR TWELVE YEARS- IN TWO
THOUSAND SEVENTEEN I WAS- THE
WORKERS COMP JUDGE OF THE YEAR-
BY THE CALIFORNIA STATE BAR.
AND THEN A- STEP DOWN FROM THE
BENCH IN THE LAST TWO YEARS
I'VE BEEN BACK REPRESENTING
PUBLIC SAFETY EMPLOYEES. SO I
REALLY HAVE A LARGER VIEW OF
WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THESE
CASES. AND MY FIRST PERIOD OF
EMPLOYMENT AS NAFTA TOURNEY. IT
WAS UNCOMMON TO HAVE A
PRESUMPTIVE CASE TONIGHT IS I'M
SURE A LOT OF YOU KNOW THERE'S
A PATH BUT AMENDMENT BACK IN
NINETEEN NINETY EIGHT. WHICH
REALLY STRENGTH IN THESE
PRESUMPTIONS FOR THE EMPLOYEE-
VERY HARD FOR THESE THIRD PARTY
ADMINISTRATORS EMPLOYERS TO
DENY AND- IF THERE WAS A DENIAL
YOU KNEW ABOUT IT IT WAS A BIG
DEAL. AND THAT WOULD OFTEN END
UP BEFORE THE WORKERS
COMPENSATION APPEALS BOARD SO.
THAT I HAVE MY TENURE AS A
JUDGE AND I COME BACK IN A
PRACTICE AND- IT WAS JUST
INCREDIBLE THE NUMBER OF THESE
CASES THAT WERE GETTING DENIED.
VIRTUALLY EVERY CASE THAT I SAW
OF A PRESUMPTIVE MAJOR. CANCER
HEART THE SORTS OF INJURIES ARE
DENIED. AND I'M LIKE TAKE A
LOOK WHAT COULD HAPPEN WHAT WHY
THE CHANGE IN THESE CASES
SPECIFICALLY AND YOU GO BACK TO
GOVERNOR SCHWARZENEGGER AND
SENATE BILL EIGHT NINE NINE
WHERE THE PENALTY STRUCTURE IN
WORKERS COMP WITH SO RADICALLY
CHANGED WHERE. YOU HAD A CAP
PLACED ON IT AND YOU HAD THE
PENALTY ONLY OPPOSE AGAINST THE
BENEFIT ACTUALLY DELAYED AS
OPPOSED TO THE ENTIRE SPECIES
OF BENEFITS- AND BECAUSE OF
THAT CHANGE THESE. EMPLOYERS
FIGURED OUT THESE THIRD PARTY
MINISTERS THAT. IT WAS MORE
COST EFFECTIVE TO DENY THESE
CLAIMS THEN TO PICK UP THE
CLAIM AND PROVIDE BENEFITS.
OKAY AND JUST AN EXAMPLE I JUST
HAD A GUY WITH- STOMACH CANCER.
AND HE WAS HOSPITALIZED AND
THERE'S HALF A MILLION DOLLARS
IN MEDICAL EXPENSES THAT WERE.
INCURRED IN THE- ADMINISTRATOR
MADE THE DECISION HEY IF WE
DENY THIS. WE ARE A BETTER
NEGOTIATION POSITION WITH THE
HOSPITAL AND THE FIVE HUNDRED
THOUSAND DOLLARS. THEN WE WOULD
BE IF WE ACCEPTED THE CLAIM. SO
THEY ROLLED THE DICE BASICALLY-
UNFORTUNATELY THAT FELLOW
PASSED AWAY AND- I JUST SETTLED
THE DEATH BENEFIT FOR HIS
WIDOW- SO THERE IS DEFINITELY A
BUSINESS ASPECT WHAT'S
HAPPENING RIGHT NOW IT IS JUST
SIMPLY MORE COSTEFFECTIVE. FOR
SEARCH- AND I CURRENTLY HAVE
TWENTY FOUR PRESUMPTIVE
INJURIES IN MY CASELOAD. THAT'S
A 75% OF THOSE ARE CANCER 25%
HEART. OF THE TWENTY FOUR CASES
IN MY CASELOAD RIGHT NOW.
TWENTY TWO OF THEM HAVE BEEN
DENIED. THAT'S IN THE FACE OF A
PRESUMPTION. THAT'S IN THE FACE
OF A DIAGNOSIS OF CANCER WHICH
HOW DO WE BUT A PRESUMPTION
THAT'S WORK RELATED THAT THAT
THAT SHOULD BE ALMOST
IMPOSSIBLE. TWENTY TWO OUT OF
TWENTY FOUR. IT IS SORT OF HARD
TO BREATHE IN THIS THING SO THE
FIRST TIME I'VE SPOKEN IN A
MATTER. OF SO THERE'S A REAL
COST OF THIS DELAY. I MENTIONED
MISTER WHITE LEE WHO
UNFORTUNATELY PASSED AWAY. I
CAN GIVE YOU STORY AFTER STORY
AFTER STORY. OF PEOPLE IN THE
UNCERTAIN PLACE OF. IS MY CLEAN
GOING TO BE ACCEPTED OR NOT.
RIGHT WHERE DO I GO FOR MEDICAL
CARE. AM I GONNA BURN ALL OF MY
SICK LEAVE CREDITS. HOW MY
GOING TO SUPPORT MY FAMILY
DURING THIS TIME. THERE'S A
REAL COST TO THESE DENIALS AND
THEY'RE HAPPENING ALMOST EVERY
ONE OF THESE CASES. MY TIME IS
PROBABLY CLOSE TO RUNNING OUT-
THAT. I'LL JUST SAY THAT THE
CURRENT PROPOSAL OF INCREASING.
THE PENALTY AMOUNTS TO TWENTY
FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS. IS GONNA
BE INSIGNIFICANT. IT JUST WILL
NOT DO THE TRICK YOU GUYS. AND
LADIES IT'S JUST IT'S NOT GOING
TO BE. ADEQUATE IT'S NOT GOING
TO MOVE THE NEEDLE- THERE
REALLY NEEDS TO BE A
FUNDAMENTAL CHANGE IN THE
PENALTY STRUCTURE WHEN WE LOOK
AT THESE CASES- MISTER PHOENIX
JUST A QUICK QUESTION MY NOTES
SAY THAT YOU'RE A FORMER.
WORKERS COMPENSATION JUDGE. ARE
YOU NOW AN APPLICANT'S ATTORNEY
YES YES IT REPRESENTING APPLE
SAYS IT CRACKED YES ALRIGHT
WHAT ARE STEPPING DOWN FROM THE
BENCH A GOOD FRIEND OF MINE WHO
DID PUBLIC SAFETY CASES
UNFORTUNATELY PASSED AWAY SO
I'VE STEPPED INTO HIS PRACTICE
SO. FOR ALMOST LAST TWO YEARS
I'VE BEEN BACK REPRESENTING
PUBLIC SAFETY. THANK YOU. THANK
YOU FOR THAT THANK YOU VERY
MUCH FOR YOUR TIME TODAY
ARAMBULA APPRECIATED. JUST ONE
COMMENT I'VE TALKED ENOUGH AND
NOT TO YOU SIR THANK YOU VERY
MUCH FOR YOUR TESTIMONY JUST
ONE COMMON I'VE TALKED TO MANY
OF THE COMMITTEE MEMBERS ABOUT
THE CONTEXT HERE AND I. SPOKE
WITH SENATOR CORTEZ THE AS WELL-
GENERALLY. WITH SIGNIFICANT
REFORMS TO WORKERS COMPENSATION
SYSTEM. ALL PARTIES ARE AT THE
TABLE THE PROCESS IS OVERSEEN
BY THE GOVERNOR. WE HAD ONE
PROCESS UNDER SCHWARZENEGGER
WHICH MISTER PHOENIX MENTIONED
THERE WAS ANOTHER PROCESS UNDER
GOVERNOR JERRY BROWN MORE
RECENTLY. WE EXPECT THERE WILL
BE ONE A PROCESS A WORKERS COMP
REFORM PROCESS UNDER GOVERNOR
NEWSOM- LIKELY IN HIS SECOND
TERM. HE'S HE'S OCCUPIED RIGHT
NOW WITH VARIOUS THINGS.
INCLUDING THE BUDGET AND- AND
OTHER MATTERS. BUT IN MY HUMBLE
OPINION THE BEST WAY TO PROCEED
ON WORKERS COMP REFORM- AND
PEOPLE REASONABLE PEOPLE MAY
DISAGREE WITH THIS BUT THE I
THINK THE BEST WAY TO PROCEED
IS TO HAVE ALL PARTIES AT THE
TABLE- THEIR MAJOR INTEREST
HERE- IN IN CALIFORNIA AND THE
WORKERS COMP SYSTEM. AND I
THINK ANY OTHER APPROACH STARTS
TO BECOME PIECEMEAL THERE MAY
BE VALID REASONS FOR THE
APPROACH. NEVERTHELESS THERE
ARE MANY MANY AFFECTED PARTIES
LOCAL GOVERNMENTS. OTHER LABOR
BUSINESS AND SO FORTH- THE
APPLICANTS ATTORNEYS- ARE
STAKEHOLDERS AS WELL AND I'VE
I'VE DEALT WITH HIM RECENTLY ON
A FEW BILLS IN FACT WE HAD A
BILL- THAT WAS PRETTY
AGGRESSIVE ENOUGH THAT BILL WAS
SCALED BACK ON THE SAME THEORY-
THAT WORKERS COMP REFORM IS
BEST. DONE WHEN EVERYONE'S AT
THE TABLE- IT'S A VERY DELICATE
COMPLICATED SYSTEM. SO WITH
THAT LET'S GO TO THE OPPOSITION
WITNESSES. APPARENTLY THE
OPPOSITION WITNESSES- GOTCHA
GOTCHA EXCUSE ME EXCUSE ME-
THERE ARE OTHER SUPPORT
WITNESSES WHO WISH TO
PARTICIPATE BY PHONE. AND ALL
GO TO THE- MODERATOR NOW THE-
EIGHTEEN ANTI MODERATOR- AND
LET'S START TO HEARING FROM
THOSE FOLKS. THANK YOU MISTER
CHAIR LADIES AND GENTLEMEN THE
PHONE LINES IF YOU WISH TO MAKE
PUBLIC COMMENT TODAY PLEASE
PRESS ONE FOLLOWED BY ZERO ON
YOUR TOUCH TONE PHONE. A. T. T.
OPERATOR WILL GIVE YOUR LIGHT
NUMBER OFF LINE IN THE BACK IN
THE QUEUE AGAIN FOR A PUBLIC
COMMENT PLEASE PRESS ONE ZERO
AT THIS TIME. L. ONE MOMENT WE
HAVE ONE QUEUING UP. FOR
EVERYBODY ELSE GO AHEAD ONE
ZERO. AND WE DO HAVE A COUPLE
WITH OPERATORS WHEN. ONE MOMENT
MISTER CHAIR. IT'S AN AWKWARD
PROCESS BUT WE KNOW YOU'RE
DOING YOUR BEST SIR. THANK YOU
THANK YOU VERY MUCH I
APPRECIATE THAT AND OUR FIRST
STOP- PUBLIC COMMENT WILL COME
FROM MY NINETEEN YOUR OPEN. IN
NINETEEN COMMUTERS. YES CAN YOU
HEAR ME. YES GO AHEAD. I'M
SORRY CAN YOU HEAR ME. WE CAN
HEAR YOU HELLO. THANK YOU SO
MUCH COOL QUERY WITH THE
AMERICAN FEDERATION OF STATE
COUNTY AND MUNICIPAL EMPLOYEES
CALLING IN SUPPORT. THANK YOU
SIR. NEXT. AND IT'S WE'RE GONNA
GO TO LINE EIGHTEEN YOU ARE
OPEN PLEASE GO AHEAD. EIGHTEEN
TOOK THEMSELVES OUT TO Q.
EVERYBODY ELSE PLEASE GO AHEAD
HIT ONE FILED BY ZERO AT THIS
TIME IF YOU'D LIKE TO MAKE
PUBLIC COMMENT- SB. THREE THREE
FIVE. MR KERRY NOBODY ELSE'S
QUEUING UP AT THE TIME ALL
RIGHT THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ARE
THERE ANY PERSONS HERE IN
PERSON WHO'D LIKE TO SPEAK IN
FAVOR OF THE BILL. ANY PERSONS
HERE IN PERSON. ALL RIGHTS AND
ANYONE ON THE STEPS OF THE
CAPITOL AT THAT. STATION WHICH
IS AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC TO
COMMENT ANY OTHER PERSONS. IF
NOT LET'S GO TO THE OPPOSE
WITNESSES- THE FIRST I HAVE TO
NAMES THE FIRST IS FAITH
GORGEOUS ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA ASSOCIATION OF JOINT
POWERS AUTHORITIES FAITH PLEASE
GO AHEAD THANK YOU MR CHAIRMAN
MEMBERS FAITH FOR JUST ON
BEHALF OF THE CALIFORNIA
ASSOCIATION OF JOINT POWERS
AUTHORITIES MOST PUBLIC
ENTITIES SELF FIND THEIR
WORKERS COMPENSATION COVERAGE
AND NOT FOR PROFIT JPA. THEY'VE
DONE SO SINCE THE SEVENTIES AND
EIGHTIES WHEN COMMERCIAL
COVERAGE WAS DIFFICULT TO
SECURE FOR PUBLIC ENTITIES AND
MISSION IS TO HELP ALL INJURED
WORKERS RECEIVE APPROPRIATE
CARE AND BENEFITS AS SOON AS
POSSIBLE AND TO HELP THEM TO
RETURN TO WORK AS SOON AS
THEY'RE SAFELY ABLE. THE BILL
IS FUNDAMENTALLY AN EQUITABLE
PUNITIVE AND A GIFT OF TAXPAYER
DOLLARS AND FOR THESE REASONS
WERE IN STRONG OPPOSITION TO SB
THREE THIRTY FIVE. AS DRAFTED
AND AS PROPOSED TO BE AMENDED
BY THE AUTHOR. THE AUTHORS
PROPOSED AMENDMENTS TARGET
TAXPAYER DOLLARS WITH A 5000%
INCREASE IN THE CURRENT
PENALTY. WITH NO RATIONAL DATA
TO CLEAN BEHIND THESE BENEFITS
WE DID DO AN INTERNAL CLAIMS
REVIEW OF CLAIMS THAT HAVE BEEN
DENIED AND I WOULD LIKE TO
SHARE BRIEFLY SOME OF THOSE
OUTCOMES. AN INTERNAL REVIEW OF
OUR CLAIMS OVER THE LAST YEAR
AND A HALF SHOWED THAT 20% OF
DENIALS WERE DUE TO THE INJURED
WORKER REFUSING TO SIGN A
STATEMENT OR TO PROVIDE MEDICAL
RECORDS. 20% A DENIAL FOR
NEGATIVE COVERED CASES. 20% OF
DENIALS FOR DUE TO THE
PHYSICIANS INDICATION THAT THEY
COULD NOT CONFIRM A DIAGNOSIS
OF THE STATED INJURY OR
REPORTED THAT THE INJURY OR
ILLNESS WAS NOT CAUSED BY WORK.
27% OF DENIALS WERE BECAUSE
RECORDS WERE EVALUATIONS COULD
NOT BE OBTAINED WITHIN THE
STATUTORY DEADLINE OF NINETY
DAYS. WE WISH IT WAS QUICKER
WOULD LOVE TO WORK WITH THE
COMMITTEE ON WAYS TO EXPEDITE
THOSE BENEFITS. MANY OF THEM
ARE OUTSIDE OF THE CONTROL OF
THE PUBLIC EMPLOYER. CURRENT
LAW HEAVILY REGULATES THE
HANDLING OF CLAIMS AND
COMPLIANCE IS AUDITED ANNUALLY
BUT FINES IN THE HUNDREDS OF
THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS. FOR BAD
PRACTICES AND INCLUDE THE
REMOVAL OF YOUR ABILITY TO
ADMINISTER CLAIMS. AS NOTED IN
THE ANALYSIS UNSUPPORTED DENIAL
OF ALL LIABILITY OF CLAIMS A
CURSED AND LESS THAN A HALF OF
THE HALF OF THE HALF OF A
PERCENT. IN THOUSANDS OF CLAIMS
THAT WERE AUDITED EVEN WHEN
COMPLAINTS THAT HAVE COMPLAINED
EXCUSE ME EVEN WHEN CLAIMS TO
HAVE COMPLAINTS ARE CONSIDERED
AN THOSE AUDITS. ALL PENALTIES
OCCASIONALLY PUBLISHED CLAIMS
HANDLING THESE PENALTIES SERVE
AS A LITIGATION HOOK. THE SIZE
OF THE PROPOSED PENALTY WILL
CREATE INCENTIVE FOR
LITIGATION. ANY DENIED CLAIMS
IS AN INCREASED RISK FOR
LITIGATION NOBODY WANTS TO GO
DOWN THAT PATH THEY WANT TO
PROVIDE THOSE TIMELY BENEFITS.
HAVING AN INCREASE THAT'S FIVE
TIMES THE AMOUNT OF THE DENIED
BENEFIT IS A VERY EXCESSIVE
PENALTY PAID WITH TAXPAYER
DOLLARS. THESE TYPES OF
PENALTIES THREATENED TO FORCE
PAYMENT AND ACCEPTANCE OF NON
INDUSTRIAL CLAIMS OR FACE
COSTLY AND TIME INTENSIVE
LITIGATION. I DO WANT TO
BRIEFLY CLOSE WITH A QUOTE FROM
THE APPLICANT ATTORNEY FROM SAN
FRANCISCO THAT WAS RECENTLY
PUBLISHED. IN CASES OF POLICE
AND FIREFIGHTERS CONTRACTING
CANCER APPLICANT ATTORNEY STILL
MUST PROVE THAT THEIR CLIENT
EXPOSURE TO CARCINOGENS HAPPENS
ON THE JOB. EVEN IF DOING SO
DOESN'T OFTEN CONSTITUTE A HIGH
BURDEN. ANY POLICE OFFICER WHO
FILLED HIS VEHICLE IS EXPOSED
TO BENZENE WHICH IS GASOLINE.
ANY PATROL OFFICER WHO WORKS IN
TRAFFIC AND HAS HIS WINDOW
ROLLED DOWN IT'S GOING TO BE
EXPOSED TO EXHAUST IT'S NOT A
HIGH BURDEN. AND QUOTE. THERE'S
NO JUSTIFICATION FOR A PENALTY
INCREASE AT THIS SIZE. IT
CERTAINLY WON'T ADMINISTER
BENEFITS ANY QUICKER BY
INTRODUCING LITIGATION WHICH IS
MOST DETRIMENTAL TO THE INJURED
WORKER. IN ADDITION TO TAX FREE
WAGES AND PENSIONS THAT ARE
AVAILABLE TO SAFETY OFFICERS
THIS BILL PROPOSES BASELESS
MULTIPLIERS AND CREATES
TAXPAYER FUNDED BONUSES FOR
DELAYS THAT ARE OUTSIDE OF THE
EMPLOYERS CONTROL. WE'RE
WHOLEHEARTEDLY COMMITTED TO
WORKING WITH THIS COMMITTEE TO
FIND WAYS TO IMPROVE THE SYSTEM
WE DON'T BELIEVE THAT THIS BILL
IS A STEP IN THAT DIRECTION AND
FOR THOSE REASONS WERE OPPOSED.
THANK YOU MISS PORGES. AND NOW
A FROM THE PRIVATE SIDE OF THE
WORLD MISTER JASON SCHMELZER ON
BEHALF OF THE PUBLIC RISK
INNOVATIVE INNOVATION SOLUTIONS
AND MANAGEMENT AND THE
CALIFORNIA COALITION ON WORKERS
COMPENSATION PLEASE GO AHEAD
SIR THANK YOU MR CHAIRMAN
MEMBERS IT SAID IT'S GOOD TO BE
BACK HERE AGAIN AND I JUST WHEN
I THINK EVERYBODY IN YOUR
STATUS FOR THE AMOUNT OF TIME
AND EFFORT THAT HAS GONE INTO
DISCUSSING THIS BILL I'M SURE-
WITH US BUT ALSO WITH THE OTHER
SIDE SO JUST THANK YOU FOR
THAT. I KNOW IT'S NOT EASY.
THIS BILL REPRESENTS A FIVE.
1000% INCREASE AND PENALTIES ON
A PUBLIC EMPLOYERS AND PRIVATE
EMPLOYERS BUT I'LL COME BACK TO
THAT. 5000% IT'S JUST NOT
CREDIBLE IN TERMS OF SCALING
EXISTING POLICY. TO ADVANCE
THAT BILL HERE'S WHY. THERE IS
NOT A SINGLE SHRED OF EVIDENCE
DATA. TO BACK THIS BILL MISTER
CHAIR YOU TALKED ABOUT PRIOR
REFORM EFFORTS THAT WERE DONE
AT A LABOR MANAGEMENT
NEGOTIATING TABLE THE OTHER
FACTOR THAT PLAYED HEAVILY IN
THOSE NEGOTIATIONS. WAS THAT
THEY WERE VERY DATA DRIVEN AND
WE DO HAVE DATA THERE IS A TON
OF DATA THE LOBBYIST FOR THE
SPONSOR SITS ON THE COMMISSION
OF HEALTH AND SEES HEALTH AND
SAFETY AND WORKERS
COMPENSATION. THEY STUDIED THE
WORKERS COMPENSATION SYSTEM
NONSTOP IT'S LABOR MANAGEMENT
BACKED THE KICKS OUT A LOT OF
RESEARCH THIS COMMITTEE
FREQUENTLY LOOKS TO THAT
COMMISSION TO GIVE US A COMMON
SET OF FACTS UPON WHICH TO
OPERATE. THE COMMISSION PUTS
OUT A TWO HUNDRED AND SEVENTY
FIVE PAGE REPORT EVERY YEAR
THAT SLICES AND DICES THE
WORKERS COMPENSATION SYSTEM UP
ONE SIDE AND DOWN THE OTHER
PUBLIC SECTOR PRIVATE SECTOR
ENFORCEMENT AUDITS ALL OF IT SO
FOR. THE OTHER IN THE SPONSOR
TO BRING THIS BILL FORD WITH
THE COMPLETE LACK OF EVIDENCE
SHOULD BE A GIANT RED FLAG.
I'VE COME IN HERE TIME AFTER
TIME AND TALKED ABOUT THE REBUT
ABILITY OF PRESUMPTIONS. WE
HAVE A VERY VERY LIMITED
ABILITY. UNDER THE LAW TO
DEMONSTRATE THAT A CLAIM IS NOT
RELATED TO WORK OKAY AND THE
ARGUMENT BACK TO US HAS ALWAYS
BEEN WELL THE REBUTTABLE. THE
LARGEST IMPACT OF THIS BILL IS
GOING TO SEND A SIGNAL TO
PUBLIC EMPLOYERS THAT THEY
SHOULD NOT. BE GOOD STEWARDS OF
TAXPAYER DOLLARS AND THEY
SHOULD NOT QUESTION THESE
CLAIMS EVEN WHEN. IN THE FEW
CIRCUMSTANCES THERE IS EVIDENCE
TO THE CONTRARY BECAUSE IF THEY
DO IT. AND THEY'RE WRONG THEY
WILL GET HIT WITH A MASSIVE
PENALTY. THE APPLICANT ATTORNEY
THAT SPOKE A FEW A FEW NUMBERS
I'M GONNA GIVE YOU A FEW
DIFFERENT NUMBERS PRESENT ALSO
DID A REVIEW OF CLAIMS FOR MORE
THAN TWENTY FOUR. IN OUR REVIEW
OF CLAIMS 86% OF THE CLAIMS
WERE ACCEPTED ALMOST
IMMEDIATELY. AND OF THE CLAIMS
THAT WERE DENIED 1% WERE
OVERTURNED. THAT IS NOT US
GETTING IT WRONG THE DATA
SIMPLY DOES NOT SUPPORT THIS.
THE APPLICANT TOURNEY ALSO
MENTION THAT THESE PENALTIES
WOULD ONLY BE APPLIED ONCE
ADJUDICATED BY A JUDGE THAT IS
NOT IN FACT THE CASE FREQUENTLY
THESE PENALTIES ARE FILED AND
THEN THEY'RE LEFT AS PART OF
THE SETTLEMENT NEGOTIATION AT
THE END OF THE CLAIM. JUDGES IN
COURTS DON'T WANT TO SPEND THE
TIME TRYING THESE ISSUES
BECAUSE THEY'RE RATHER.
COMPLICATED AND SO THEY'RE
PUSHED OUT INTO THE HALL TO
SETTLE THEM THIS IS A
SETTLEMENT MAGNIFYING TYPE OF
POLICY IT WILL PUT RISK ON THE
FILE THAT WILL HAVE TO BE
SETTLED. TO AVOID THE RISK OF
TRIAL THAT'S THE WAY THE SYSTEM
WORKS. AND FINALLY I JUST WANT
TO MENTION THIS THAT DOES APPLY
TO PRIVATE EMPLOYERS THERE WAS
A CODE NINETEEN PRESUMPTION
THAT WAS PASSED LAST YEAR IF
YOU LOOK AT THE BILL THE COVERT
NINETEEN PRESUMPTION IS
INCLUDED IN THE TYPES OF
INJURIES THAT ARE COVERED BY
THIS BILL THAT PRESUMPTION
APPLIES TO. ALL EMPLOYERS
STATEWIDE. IT'S ALSO PRETTY
CLEAR THAT IN A COMMUNITY
SPREAD DISEASE EMPLOYERS ARE.
BEING FORCED UNDER THE
PRESUMPTION TO TAKE CLAIMS THAT
ARE NOT WORK RELATED AND THAT'S
FINE UNDERSTAND BY THE STATE
THAT THAT- IN A PANDEMIC. WE'RE
WE'RE WE GOT OVER THAT LAST
YEAR. BUT NOW TO COME IN
INCREASED PENALTY ON THOSE
CLAIMS. BY 5000% WITHOUT ANY
EVIDENCE IT'S JUST SOMETHING WE
CANNOT SUPPORT. MISTER CHAIR
APPRECIATE- EVERYTHING THAT
THAT THE COMMITTEE IS DONEI
APPRECIATE- THE AMENDMENTS
COMING THE OTHER DIRECTION I
THINK A HUNDRED AND 50%
INCREASE ON PENALTIES.
CERTAINLY BY ANY STANDARD IN
THIS LEGISLATURE IS AGGRESSIVE
AND REASONABLE- AND- WE WOULD
URGE YOU TO BACK THE CHAIR IN
THIS PARTICULAR INSTANCE- AND
RIPOSTE THANK YOU MISTER
SCHMELZER OTHER OTHER PERSONS
HERE IN THE ROOM WHO WISH TO
SPEAK IN OPOSITION TO THE
BILL. MISTER CHAIR WITH YOUR
INDULGENCE OF PRIOR WITNESS
REFERENCE ME DIRECTLY I JUST
WOULD LIKE TO PUT SOMETHING ON
THE RECORD IF YOU WOULDN'T MIND.
GO AHEAD PLEASE THANK YOU SIR
CHRISTIE BAMA BEHALF THE
CALIFORNIA PROFESSIONAL
FIREFIGHTERS I DO IN FACT THAT
ON THE COMMISSION HEALTH AND
SAFETY. AND WORKERS
COMPENSATION. AND THERE'S A LOT
OF AGGREGATE DATA THAT WE SEE.
BUT IN MY ROLE AS AN ADVOCATE
FOR THE FIREFIGHTERS I
CONTACTED THOSE DATA SOURCES
INCLUDING THE WCI ARE BE. THE
INSURANCE RATING BOROUGH THAT
SETS RATES IN THE STATE. WHO
SAID NO ONE TRACKS PENALTIES
FIFTY EIGHT FOURTEEN PENALTIES
IN THE SYSTEM. I JUST WANT TO
PUT THAT ON THE RECORD THANK
YOU. THANK YOU. GO AHEAD SIR.
THERE'S IN OPPOSITION TO THE
BILL GO AHEAD MISTER CHAIRMAN
MURDERS GERMAN MURDERS ABOUT
THE AMERICAN PROPERTY CASUALTY
INSURANCE ASSOCIATION
APPRECIATE THE COMMITTEE'S WORK
ON THE BILL WE ARE OPPOSED TO
THE BILL IMPRINT- AND WE ARE
VALUE WAITING THE COMMITTEE
AMENDMENTS TO SEE IF WE COULD
REMOVE OPPOSITION. THANK YOU.
THE FIRM. GOOD MORNING IT'S A
FAIR MEMBERS ALL MIKE GOOD
MORNING MR CHAIRMAN MEMBERS
ACTUALLY HOFFMAN ON BEHALF OF
THE CALIFORNIA CHAMBER OF
COMMERCE- WE ALSO AND I THINK
THE CHAIRED THE COMMITTEE FOR
THE WORK ON THE BILL AND WHILE
WE ARE PRESENTLY OPPOSED WE
ARE ALSO PRESENTLY REVIEWING
THE COMMITTEES AMENDMENTS TO
HOPE IF THOSE WERE PASSED TODAY
HOPEFULLY REMOVE OPPOSITION
THANK YOU THANK YOU OTHER OTHER
PERSONS HERE IN THE ROOM WOULD
LIKE TO SPEAK IN OPPOSITION TO
THE BILL. MISTER CHAIRMAN
MEMBERS JOHN NORWOOD ON BEHALF
OF THE INDEPENDENT INSURANCE
AGENTS AND BROKERS FOR
CALIFORNIA. LIBERTY MUTUAL AND
ZENITH INSURANCE COMPANIES.
THANK YOU THANK YOU SIR ANYONE
ELSE HERE IN THE ROOM. WISHING
TO SPEAK- LET'S GO NOW TO OUR
MODERATING OPERATOR. FOR ANY
PHONE IN. TESTIMONY GO AHEAD
SIR. THANK YOU MISTER CHAIR- IF
YOU WOULD LIKE TO EXPRESS
OPPOSITION FOR SB THREE THREE
FIVE PLEASE PRESS ONE FOLLOWED
BY ZERO AT THIS TIME ONE FILED
BY ZERO EIGHTY G. OPERATE WILL
GIVE YOUR LINE NUMBER. AND WILL
BEGIN TODAY WITH LINE TWENTY
ONE PLEASE GO AHEAD. THANK YOU
MR CHAIRMAN MEMBERS STATE
CONLEY WITH THE L. A. COUNTY
BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WE OPPOSE
THE BILL IN PRINT WE'RE
REVIEWING THE CHAIRS AND THE
MEN AND WITHOUT THE COMMITTEE
TO REJECT THE AUTHORS OF THAT
MESSAGE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU
NEXT PLEASE. ONE MOMENT A
COUPLE MORE PEOPLE ARE DOING UP.
OKAY OKAY. THANK YOU FOR YOUR
PATIENCE THERE WITH OPERATORS.
NOBODY ELSE SCORED AT ONE ZERO
NOW TO PLACE YOURSELF IN THE
QUEUE. AND WE ARE GOING TO GO
TO LINE NUMBER FOURTEEN YOU ARE
OPEN. MISTER CHAIR AND MEMBERS
OF THE TEAM PERSONS CALLING
TODAY ON BEHALF OF THE URBAN
COUNTIES OF CALIFORNIA ALSO ON
BEHALF OF MY COLLEAGUES AT THE
CALIFORNIA STATE ASSOCIATION OF
COUNTIES IN OPPOSITION TO THE
BILL AND PRINT THANK YOU. THANK
YOU NEXT PLACE. MY TWENTY FOUR
YOU ARE OPEN. GOOD MORNING
MISTER CHAIR MEMBERS ON SILVER
MILL AND REPRESENTING
ACCLAMATION INSURANCE
MANAGEMENT SERVICES AND ALLIED
MANAGED CARE IN STRONG
OPPOSITION TO THE CURRENT BILL
THANK YOU. THANK YOU NEXT
WITNESS FIND TWENTY. THANK YOU
WHY TWENTY THREE PLEASE GO
AHEAD. THE MORNING CARE NUMBERS
JOHNNY BEING ABLE TO LEAVE
CALIFORNIA CITIES SPECT BILLY
AT. RESPECTIVOS THE BILL AND
BRETT THANK YOU THANK YOU
MISTER PENA. NEXT WITNESS. WE
WILL ALIGN TWELVE YOUR OPEN.
THE CAT ON BEHALF OF THE RULE
COUNTY- REPRESENT OF THE
CALIFORNIA IN OPPOSITION TO THE
BILL AND PRINT THANK YOU. THANK
YOU ANALYTE SEPT ONE SEVENTEEN
PLEASE GO AHEAD. I'M HERE AT
THE DODD FRANK MCCOURT'S
REPEALING THE AMENDMENT MONDAY
OUT IN JAPAN THANK YOU. WHAT
WHAT WHAT WAS THE AFFILIATION
ON THAT LAST FOR THE LAST
WITNESS. THE ASSOCIATION OF
CALIFORNIA HEALTHCARE DISTRICT
OKAY THANK YOU THANK YOU VERY
MUCH. NEXT WITNESS. AND A FINAL
REMINDER PLEASE PRESS ONE
FOLLOWED BY ZERO TO TESTIFY FOR
SB THREE THREE FIVE IN
OPPOSITION. MISTER CHAIR NOBODY
ELSE'S QUEUING UP THIS TIME.
THANK YOU AND ARE THERE ANY
PERSONS ON THE CAPITOL STEPS AT
THE- TESTIMONY STATION THERE
ARE THERE ANY PERSONS THERE WHO
WISH TO. OFFER TESTIMONY. IF
NOT THAT CONCLUDES THE
OPPORTUNITY FOR TESTIMONY
EITHER PRO OR CON AND NOT LET
ME INVITE ANY QUESTIONS BY
COMMITTEE MEMBERS- AND I'LL
REMIND EVERYONE THERE IS
MOTION AND SECOND ON THE TABLE
ON ANY QUESTIONS BY COMMITTEE
MEMBERS AT THIS POINT MR WOULD.
THANK YOU MISTER CHAIR I'D
LIKE. I'D LIKE TO CLARIFY
OBVIOUSLY WE HAVE A BILL IN
FRANCE. YOU'VE OFFERED AS THE
CHERRY OF OFFERED AMENDMENTS
THE AUTHOR IS WILLING TO ACCEPT.
THREE OF THE FOUR AMENDMENTS TO
THE TO THE FOR AMENDMENTS. LIKE
TO ASK THE AUTHOR- TO TALK
ABOUT THE OTHER TWO THE TWO MEN
MISTER NOT WILLING TO ACCEPT
AND WHY. IF I MAY THROUGH THE
SURE THING GOING THAT CENTER
PLEASE GO AHEAD THANK YOU- BUT-
THE FIRST TWO AMENDMENTS OR A
LIMITED ANY CHANGES TO ANY
TIMELINES FOR- AN EMPLOYER TO
DETERMINE COMPENSABLE WITTY SO
WE'VE- AGREED TO THAT THERE WAS
A REQUEST. THE BILL WAS
ORIGINALLY WRITTEN. UP WITH THE
TIMELINE CHANGES FROM NINETY TO
FORTY FIVE DAYS THAT'S GONNA.
ELIMINATE THE CHANGE THE AMOUNT
OF IMMEDIATE MEDICAL TREATMENT
AND A PLAYER MUST PROVIDE TO AN
INJURED WORKER- THAT WAS GOING
TO GO FOR TEN THOUSAND
SEVENTEEN THOUSAND WE'VE-
AGREED TO. SKEWS ME AGREED TO
TAKE THAT OUT. OF THREE. IS THE
PENALTY PROVISIONS THAT MOST OF
THE DISCUSSION HAS BEEN ABOUT
TODAY- PAYMENT FOR- IS SORT OF
A COMPANION PIECE TO THREE
WHICH REMOVES LANGUAGE ALLOWING
THE PENALTY TO A PART OF THE
FORM OF THE ORDER SO IT'S- SORT
OF THE COMPANION TECHNICAL
PROVISION. OF IT SAYS HOME. SO
IF YOU WANT ME TO TALK ABOUT.
WHY NOT THREE. YEAH I MEAN I
MEAN IT SOUNDS LIKE WHAT WE'RE
REALLY TALKING ABOUT HERE THE
PENALTIES RIGHT SO WROTE THAT'S
ALL THAT'S LEFT TO TALK ABOUT
ALL THAT ALL DOWN TO THIS IT'S
ALL ABOUT THE PENALTIES NOW SO
EXPLAIN EXPLAIN YOUR POSITION
ON THAT PLEASE RIGHT RIGHT
RIGHT IT'S SOMEBODY THANK YOU
VERY MUCH SIR. THANK YOU VERY
MUCH OF IT YOU KNOW- I'VE SPENT
THE LAST- TWENTY YEARS OF LOCAL
GOVERNMENT- IN THE THIRD
LARGEST CITY IN THE STATE. AND
THE LARGEST COUNTY IN THE BAY
AREA- WHEN I GOT UP HERE PEOPLE
TOLD ME. BE WHERE YOU'RE GOING
TO HEAR A LOT OF EXAGGERATION I
DON'T KNOW WHERE THE FIVE
THOUSAND. PERCENT INCREASE.
OPPOSITION I CAN UNDERSTAND.
WHY THEY ONLY WANT TO PAY THREE
HUNDRED DOLLARS. IF THE AND
REASONABLY TONIGHT A THREE
THOUSAND DOLLAR CLAIM WHICH IS
THE CASE NOW- WERE TWENTY FIVE
PERCENT- WHICH IS ALSO A VERY
VERY SMALL. I THINK NON
PUNITIVE PENALTY REALLY IT'S IT
ALMOST DEFIES IT'S ALMOST AN
OXYMORON- WE IF YOU WERE TO
LOOK AT THE TWO HUNDRED
THOUSAND DOLLAR CLAIM. AND
WE'RE TOLD. THAT THE 25% UNDER
THREE. HUNDRED M. M. IF THREE
THAT WERE BEING ASKED TO TAKE-
IS A HUGE INCREASE OVER THE 10%
THAT ALREADY EXISTS. REMEMBER
WE HAVE A FIFTY THOUSAND
DOLLARS. THIS THIS AMENDMENT.
THAT WERE BEING **** HAS TO
TAKE ALSO CAPS AT TWENTY FIVE
THOUSAND. CAPS IS 25% WHICH IS
A 150% HIGHER THAN THE OLD 10%
BUT NOW YOU COME RIGHT BACK
UNDER THE AMENDMENT WITH THE TO
CAP THE TWENTY FIVE THOUSAND
DOLLARS. PER EIGHT. SO LET'S
TAKE A TWO HUNDRED THOUSAND
DOLLAR CLAIM LET'S JUST DO THE
MATH REAL QUICK. THE TWO
HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLAR CLAIM
UNDER THE CURRENT STATUTE.
WOULD GIVE YOU A TWENTY
THOUSAND DOLLAR PENALTY. UNDER
UNDER THE A COMMITTEE
AMENDMENTS THAT SAME TWO
HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLAR CLAIM
BECAUSE YOU HAVE A CAP OF
TWENTY FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS.
ONLY GIVES YOU FIVE THOUSAND
DOLLARS MORE. PRETTY GOOD DEAL
FOR THE OPPOSITION. UP UNDER
OUR A PROPOSED AMENDMENT IT'S
FIVE TIMES BUT WITH A CAP OF
FIFTY THOUSAND DOLLARS SO
ESSENTIALLY ON THAT TWO HUNDRED
THOUSAND DOLLAR CLAIM YOU
EFFECTIVELY HOWEVER A TRUE 25%
PENALTY OF FIFTY THOUSAND AND
THAT'S WHY WE THINK OUR MAP IS
BETTER. IN AND IT'S MORE ABOUT
A DETERRENT- I HAD THE WHAT WHY
GO TO A FIVE TIMES MULTIPLIER I
SUPPOSE IT COULD HAVE BEEN
TROUBLE DAMAGES WHICH IS VERY
COMMON STATUTES. THREE TIMES.
AS AN ATTORNEY BUT ONCE
REPRESENTED A CLIENT WHOSE
HORSE. WAS INJURED BY THE
NEIGHBORING PARTY- AND THE
INSURANCE COMPANIES WANT TO PAY
THE CLAIM FOR THE HORSE- IN
ORDER TO STATUTES.
INDETERMINATE THERE WERE
TROUBLE DAMAGES AVAILABLE FOR
THE DAMAGES INCURRED. IN WHAT I
CALL THE INSURANCE COMPANY SAID
YOU ARE AWARE THAT I WILL BE
PUTTING FOR TREBLE DAMAGES HERE
THAT'S THE PENALTY FOR NOT
HONORING THIS CLAIM THEY DID SO
IT SHOULD BE PUNITIVE THEY DID
SO IN AND JUSTICE WAS NOT THE
LATE- BUT HERE WE HAVE A
SITUATION IN CALIFORNIA TODAY
WERE THAT TROUBLE DAMAGES
STATUTE STILL EXIST FOR HORSE.
IF YOUR HORSES IS HURT BY THE
NEIGHBOR. YOU GET TROUBLE
DAMAGES. IF A FIREFIGHTER IS
HURT ON THE JOB. WE'RE TALKING.
TWENTY FIVE THOUSAND DOLLAR CAP
25% MAXIMUM- WE'RE JUST TRYING
TO MAKE. MAKE THIS JUST THAT'S
ALL WE'RE TRYING TO DO AND I'VE
BEEN MORE THAN HAPPY TO
CONTINUE TALK ABOUT TALKING
ABOUT WHAT IS THE CORRECT
FORMULA HERE BUT I DON'T THINK
THREE IS THE CORRECT FORMULA IS
I DON'T THINK IT GIVES YOU A
TRUE. AND SIGNIFICANT INCREASE
OVER WHERE WE ARE NOW- WHICH
REALLY IS NO DETERRENT AT ALL
AGAINST THESE CLAIMS COMING
FORWARD. THANK YOU. SENATOR
CORTEZ CO I'VE ASKED A FEW
TIMES- REALLY OUT OF. CURIOSITY
BUT ALSO BECAUSE IT'S THE CRUX
OF THE ISSUE- THE UNREASONABLE
DENIAL. HELLO OFTEN IN THE
STATE OF CALIFORNIA IN A
TYPICAL YEAR. ARE THERE UNDER
REASONABLE DENIALS OF CLAIMS
FOR FIREFIGHTERS THANK YOU
THANK YOU MISTER CHAIR OF AS
YOU HEARD WE WERE NOT ABLE TO
PROVIDE THE EXACT NUMBER BUT
BUT I'M NOT SURE WE NEED THE
EXACT NUMBER BECAUSE OF THAT
NUMBER ISSUE THEN FRANKLY THIS
COMMITTEE HEARINGS A TEMPEST IN
A TEAPOT WHAT WE SHOULD BE
ESTABLISHING A PUNITIVE NUMBER-
NOBODY SHOULD BE FIGHTING THIS
HARD TO OPPOSE IT IF THEY'RE
FEW CLAIMS. THAT WE SHOULD ALL
GO ALONG THEIR MERRY WAY IF THE
NUMBER IS HI THERE WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT AN INDUSTRY THAT
IS ABUSING THE CLAIMS PROCESS-
BUT I'M REASONABLY DENY CLAIMS
OR PRESUMPTIVE IN THE FIRST
PLACE TO THE PEOPLE THAT WE
VALUE MOST IN OUR PUBLIC
EMPLOYMENT. OUR FIREFIGHTERS
FOR EXAMPLE SO IN THAT CASE I
DON'T THINK WE CAN GO WRONG I
THINK IF WE WERE TO ACCEPT OF
MY MOUTH. OUR SUGGESTION. WITH
A CAP OF FIFTY THOUSAND
DOLLARS- AT FIVE TIMES. IN
THERE'S VERY FEW CLAIMS THEN
THIS MULTI BILLION DOLLAR
INDUSTRY SHOULDN'T BE SO
CONCERNED A MULTI BILLION
DOLLAR MUNICIPALITIES SHOULDN'T
BE SO CONCERNED IF WE SHOULD
JUST MOVE ON- BUT I DON'T THINK
­INK.
MIND IS THAT THIS ISN'T JUST A
DIDN'T A DETERRENT AGAINST. A
DETERRENT OF UNREASONABLE
CLAIMS. BUT IS AN INCENTIVE TO
CREATE A MORE SAFE WORK PLACE
IN THE FIRST PLACE SO THAT
THESE PRESUMPTIVE CLAIMS DON'T
ARISE. IT IF THERE'S NO. IF
THAT'S NOT. AN ISSUE THEN IT'S
NOT IN IT I THINK THAT'S
PROBABLY THE MORE FOR
FOUNDATION FOR THE- FOR THE
COMMITTEE TO TAKE UP. THANK
YOU. THANK YOU AND JUST TO. ONE
LAST THOUGHT ON THAT IT WOULD
BE HELPFUL TO KNOW. THE SCALE
AND THE SCOPE OF THE PROBLEM.
BUT YOUR BILL ADDRESSES AND- WE
TALKED ABOUT THAT IN OUR
CONVERSATIONS- AND HI YOU KNOW-
IF. TO THE EXTENT THE PROBLEM
IS GENUINE- AS I SAID BEFORE I
THINK IT CAN BE ADDRESSED. IN
AN OVERALL REFORM OF THE
WORKERS COMP SYSTEM WHEN WE'RE
WITH EVERYONE AT THE TABLE-
COMPLICATED SUBJECT WHETHER ANY
OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS
MISTER COOLEY. I'M SORRY I
THOUGHT YOU WERE- NO I WASN'T
ACTUALLY WASN'T DONE SO I BUT I
SO I APPRECIATE THE INDULGENCE
OF THE JOE HEAD MISTER WAS OUT
I WOULD JUST. I WOULD JUST SAY
LOOK- WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE
PENALTY HERE- AND I THINK THAT-
PERSONALLY I WANT TO SUPPORT
THE AUTHOR HERE TODAY- I WANT
TO KEEP THIS CONVERSATION
GOING- AND SO I WON'T BE
SUPPORTING THE MOTION- AS- AS
THE CHAIR. I THINK THAT.
THERE'S OP THERE'S COME TO
DESERVE THIS CONVERSATIONS CAN
HAPPEN THERE'S THINGS THAT CAN
HAPPEN HERE BUT I WILL BE
SUPPORTING THAT WE SUPPORT THE
AUTHOR TODAY. GOOD I THANK YOU
MR WOOD MISTER COOLEY DO YOU
HAVE A- COMMENT. YEAH I JUST
WANT A- RESPOND TO SOMETHING I
THINK- SENATE QUARTERS HE I
THINK ONE OF THE ISSUES. IS
THAT THERE IS NOT AN ADEQUATE
RECORD LAID DOWN OF THE
PROBLEMS. IN THE REALM OF
WORKERS COMP INSURANCE THIS
ACTUALLY MEANS WE CANNOT REALLY
ANALYZE THE PRO AND CON
INCENTIVES OF THE WRITTEN WORD
AS A PLACE TO WORKERS COMP. I
WAS ACTUALLY A YOUNG STAFFER IN
THE ASSEMBLY IN NINETEEN EIGHTY
TWO. WHEN OUR TOWARDS ORIGINAL.
CANCER PRESUMPTION BILLS PASSED.
I WAS CHIEF COUNSEL TO THIS
COMMITTEE. IN THE LATE NINETEEN
EIGHTIES. WHEN OUR SYSTEM GOT
SO OUT OF WHACK. THAT THE STATE
CARPENTERS FUND WHICH IS A
WORKER'S COMP INSURER OF LAST
RESORT YOU KNOW- IT GOT 285% OF
THE MARKET PLACE. IT WAS A
CRISIS IN CALIFORNIA WHEN THE
WORKERS COMP CARRIERS
RETREATED. AND SKIFF WAS. IN
THE FOR CARRYING OUT LOW HIS
WORK WHICH OF OUR MY COLLEAGUE
CHRISTIE BALBOA THERE IS A PART
OF TWO OUT OF THAT GRAPPLING
WITH THE WORKERS COMP SYSTEM
THAT WAS ESTABLISHED IN
NINETEEN NINETY THREE. I'VE
WATCHED WORKERS COMP REFORMS
UNDER THE GOVERNOR
SCHWARZENEGGER GOVERNOR BROWN.
ALWAYS IN THESE CONVERSATIONS.
THERE IS INVARIABLY A LOT OF
PUSHING AND SHOVING FROM THE
VERY INTEREST GROUPS- AS WE CAN
WE'RE ALL QUITE ACQUAINTED.
NONE THE LESS THEY ARE ALWAYS
VERY FACT BASED REFORMS HERE IN
CALIFORNIA WE ARE BLESSED SINCE
NINETEEN NINETY THREE WHICH HAS
WORK WHICH CONDUCTED STUDIES A
STATE AGENCY. WE HAVE THE
RENDON'S TO SUSAN SANTA MONICA
THAT DOES A LOT OF WORK FOR THE
WORKERS COMP FIELD. VERY OFTEN
INVOLVED AND TAP FOR THEIR
EXPERTISE TO DELVE INTO THE
MEETING OF NUMBERS LIKEWISE- OF
THE CALIFORNIA WORKERS COMP
INSURANCE RATING BUREAU WCI ARE
BE. LONG TIME PARTICIPANT IN
THESE CONVERSATIONS LIKEWISE
THE CALIFORNIA WORKERS COMP
INSTITUTE. SO IT IS MY
MADE TO WORKERS COMP ISSUES
ONCE A SPECIFIC QUESTIONS
CRYSTALLIZED AND WE PURSUE FAX
TO ELIMINATE THAT ISSUE SO THAT
IN FACT YOU CAN REACH A
CONCLUSION THAT THERE ARE OR
ARE NOT INCENTIVES. THAT THE
WORDING OF A PARTICULAR PHRASE
OR THE OPERATIONS GIVEN PENALTY
OR PROCEDURAL HURDLE IS OR IS
NOT HAPPILY WORDED OR UN
HAPPILY WORK- SO I DO THINK
PARTICULARLY DEAL AS AS I KNOW.
THE GREAT CITY OF SAN JOSE
WHERE I WENT TO HIGH SCHOOL- OF
SANTA CLARA COUNTY THESE ARE
SELF INSURED ENTITIES. THERE
ARE THERE IS A TAX PAYER STEAK
AND ALL THESE CONVERSATIONS SO
I THINK THE MATTER THAT
CONCERNS ME IS JUST THAT. THIS
PARTICULAR CONVERSATION IN A
CRITICAL TIME ACTUALLY TO HELP
OUR CALIFORNIA WORKFORCE GET
BACK EMPLOYEES BE HIRED JOBS
JUST SORT OF A LACK OF
INFORMATION TO SUPPORT THIS
PURPOSE SPECIFIC REFORM- THAT'S
NOT TO SAY THAT THERE ARE ARE
NOT FACTUAL QUESTIONS WE SHOULD
ASK PEOPLE TO. ILLUMINATE BUT-
I ACTUALLY FEEL IT'S- TO KIND
OF GO BACK TO THE PRE TWO
THOUSAND FOUR LANGUAGE ON
PENALTIES WITHOUT A FUNDAMENTAL
EXAMINATION OF DATA I THINK
THAT'S THE LOGICAL IN A VERY
UNUSUAL DIRECTION IN A WORKERS
COMP FEEL TRASHY STRONGLY
SUPPORT THE CHAIRS-
RECOMMENDATION ON BUT I THINK
FACTUAL QUESTIONS ARE ALWAYS IN
ORDER. AND THE TWO COMMITTEES
COULD EVEN INQUIRE- FOR FURTHER
STUDIES UT WE HAVE A LOT OF
RESOURCES IN CALIFORNIA TO SHED
LIGHT ON. MR COOLEY YOUR
SUGGESTION OF FURTHER STUDY IS
A- AS WELL TAKEN AND I THINK
ALL ASK OUR COMMITTEE STAFF TO
PUT TOGETHER A- AN OUTLINE FOR
THAT VERY THING TO DO A LITTLE
BIT MORE FACT GATHERING MISTER
GIBSON HAS A QUESTION OR
COMMENT THANK YOU VERY MUCH AND
I MISS HERE I APOLOGIZE FOR
BEING LATE TRYING TO WORK A
BILL OF MY OWN IT'S UP IN THE
SENATE BUT NONE THE LESS- I AM
ALSO- IS THE LAST OPPORTUNITY
THIS BILL COULD BE HEARD AND
THE REASON WHY I ASKED THAT
QUESTION IS BECAUSE- I WAS
ASKING MY- MY TEAM MEMBER- FOR.
THAT AGAIN ALIGNING SOME
COMMENTS THAT BOTH MY
COLLEAGUES. MADE MENTION OF THE
JUST THE DATA OF. HOW THIS BILL
IS HOPING. TO ADDRESS THE
PROBLEM AND I'VE HEARD FROM THE
SPEAKERS THAT I DID IN FACT
HEAR FROM- THAT THERE WAS NO
DATA. TO SHOW- CONCLUSIVELY HOW
THIS. HOW THIS BILL IS HELPING
A PROBLEM TRYING TO SOLVE THE
PROBLEM. AND MANY OF YOU KNOW
THAT I CERTAINLY I SUPPORT. YOU
KNOW OUR OUR MEN AND WOMEN IN
UNIFORM SPACE AND PUBLIC SAFETY
AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. BUT
I'M JUST HAVING A- SIMPSON
RESERVATIONS IN TERMS OF WHERE
TO GO AS RELATES TO NOT HAVING
THE DATA TO SHOW- DIRECTLY- FOR
ME RIGHT NOW IN THE
CONVERSATION CERTAINLY
APPRECIATE THE SENATOR- AND
ALSO SOME THE WITNESS THAT I
WAS ABLE TO HEAR FROM MY OFFICE
BUT I YOU KNOW I'M OF THE
OPINION THAT WE WANT TO TRY TO
FIGURE OUT I GUESS MY QUESTION
IS THIS THE LAST TIME THIS BILL
COULD BE HEARD- UNTIL THIS
INFORMATION IS PROVIDED TO US.
I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT
QUESTION I THINK IN THE CURRENT
YEAR THE ANSWER IS YES IT'S THE
LAST TIME IT CAN BE HEARD.
BECAUSE THE DEADLINE I THINK
IT'S TOMORROW- BUT- IF THE
COMMITTEE AMENDMENTS ARE
ADOPTED THE BILL. LIVES FOR
ANOTHER DAY. AND IT'LL PROCEEDS
OF THE BILL AS A VEHICLE WILL
SURVIVE AND GO TO THE NEXT
STEP. HOWEVER IT WILL HAVE BEEN
AMENDED IF THE- PROPOSED
AMENDMENTS ARE ADOPTED AND IF
THE OFF THAT THE SENATOR TAKE
THE MEMBERS TODAY. THEN IT GOES
TO. APPROACH APPROPRIATIONS YES
AND THEN OKAY AND THEN OF
COURSE OKAY. THANK YOU VERY
MUCH FOR INDULGING THANK YOU
MISTER GIBSON AND YOU
HIGHLIGHTED AGAIN AS WE'VE SAID
TO- WITH ALL DUE RESPECT
BECAUSE IT'S VERY VERY TOUGH
SUBJECT IN THE- FEELINGS ARE
STRONG. ON ALL SIDES BUT THERE.
IS SIMPLY NOT ENOUGH DATA UPON
WHICH- TO MAKE A GOOD POLICY
DECISION IN MY OPINION- AND-
THAT HAPPENS HERE IN THE STATE
CAPITAL FROM TIME TO TIME BUT
THIS SUBJECT IS A- OF HIGH
INTEREST TO MANY FOLKS WE NEED
MORE DATA. MISTER GRACE THANK
YOU MISTER CHAIR AND- HAVING
AUTHORED AB ELEVEN SIXTEEN
ELEVEN SEVENTEEN MY PASSION FOR
THE CARE AND WELL BEING OF
FIRST RESPONDERS SPECIFICALLY
FIRE AND- EMS AS WELL AS
POLICE- SHOULD GO ONE QUESTION
AND- MY AND MY HEART GOES OUT
TO EACH AND EVERYONE OF THEM
EVERY DAY- SERVING IS- A
CHAPLAIN FOR. A PARTICULAR
AGENCY I- I FOUND SOMETHING
INTERESTING TODAY THROUGH THE
TESTIMONY OF BOTH THE- AUTHOR
AND PROPONENTS AS WELL AS
OPPOSITION- AND THAT IS THAT
BOTH OF THEM AGREED ON ONE
THING. I FOR SURE AND THAT WAS
THE DATE IS NOT THERE IN REST
AT RISK OF SOUNDING REPETITIVE
TO MY COLLEAGUES AS WELL AS THE
CHAIR. I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR
THE AUTHOR AND SENATOR THANK
YOU FOR YOUR WORK ON THIS THIS
VERY NOBLE AND LAUDABLE EFFORT
TO PROVIDE MUCH NEEDED SUPPORT
I KNOW FIRST HAND- WORKING WITH
PUBLIC SECTOR SAFETY AGENCY.
THE ATROCITIES OF- CASES WHERE
IT TOOK SO LONG AND- THERE IS-
THERE IS NEED FOR ACTION TO BE
TAKEN. HOWEVER I ALSO SEE ON
THE OTHER SIDE THAT THE RECORD
NEEDS TO BE LAID OUT THE DATA
NEEDS TO BE. COMPILED AND
PRESENTED AS EVIDENCE SO I DO
ASK THE AUTHOR WAS THEIR
CONSIDERATION TO PUT SOME TYPE
OF STEADY COMPONENT INTO YOUR
BILL AND- AND- HOW WOULD THAT
HAVE WORKED AND WILL YOUR
CONSIDERATION TO IT AND HOW IT
ENDED UP TO DATE- BY- BEING THE
BILL THAT EXIST BEFORE US. YES
WE WILL BE HAPPY SUPPORT- YOU
KNOW ANY AMENDMENT THAT-
ADDRESSES THE ISSUE OF DATA IN
TERMS OF THE STUDY I MENTIONED
AND- MY PRESENTATION OUR BELIEF
THAT. OF THE DATA SHOULD BE
COLLECTED AND SHOULD BE
REPORTED BACK TO THE AUDIT UNIT
IN THE DIVISION OF WORKERS
COMPENSATION- AS WE KNOW. IT'S
GOING TO HAVE TO BE EXACTED
PROBABLY BY LEGISLATION OF.
THIS BILL OR SOME FUTURE
LEGISLATION- IT'S GONNA HAVE TO
MANDATE IT IT'S PEOPLE ARE NOT
FORTHCOMING WITH THAT
INFORMATION WE HAVE HERE TODAY.
THERE'S NO DASHBOARD YOU COULD.
A GOOGLE UP LIKE SO MANY OTHER
THINGS SO WE GET IT. WE
UNDERSTAND- THAT THAT DATE IS
NEEDED AND FUNDAMENTALLY
BELIEVE THAT THE DATA WILL BEAR
OUT- YOU KNOW SUPPORT FOR A
REMEDY LIKE WE'RE PROPOSING.
THANK YOU SENATOR JUST FOR
CLARITY'S SAKE I AM NOT
OFFERING AN AMENDMENT I WAS
JUST AT THE STATE SO I
UNDERSTAND I WAS JUST SIMPLY
START ASKING THE QUESTION
ABOUT. WAS THE CONSIDERATION
FOR A STUDY TO BE BUILT INTO
THAT FROM THE AUTHOR AND THANK
YOU FOR YOUR ANSWER YES THANK
YOU. YEAH WE DID DISCUSS IT TO
A LITTLE BIT THE- NOTION OF
PUTTING A STUDY IN THE BILL-
REGARDLESS I THINK THE STUDY.
IS NEEDED AND- AS WAS MENTIONED
BY SOME OTHER COMMITTEE
MEMBERS- THERE IS A- A DESIRE
FOR A GOOD STUDY AND I'M GONNA
ASK OUR COMMITTEE STAFFER.
ACADIA MALLEY LED BY KATIE
O'MALLEY TO. I OUTLINED STUDY
IN WILL FIGURE OUT. HOW TO GET
IT DONE AND WHO SHOULD DO IT
THANK YOU ANY OTHER QUESTIONS
OR COMMENTS. IF MR GO AHEAD
MISTER COOPER THANK YOU FOR
LONG DISCUSSION TODAY I DON'T
THINK THE AUTHOR BRING THIS
BILL FORWARD BUT I HEARD A LOT
OF STEPS TO ANOTHER BY THE END
IN BY THE INDUSTRY BUT YOU
SHOULD HAVE TO BE TOLD TO KEEP
DATA ON YOUR CASE OUTCOMES YOU
A LOT OF DATA BUT- SOME THAT IS
MISSING. IN THE PENALTIES I
MEAN. YOU THINK ABOUT THE
PENALTIES WHO KEEPS TRACK OF
HIM WAS REALLY BECAUSE- AT SOME
POINT. FOR THE MOST PART THESE
CASES SETTLE SO. YOU KNOW SO
FOR SOMEONE TO GO IN SUIT. AND
THE RESULT IS ONLY TWO OR THREE
THOUSAND DOLLARS TO DO IT
DOESN'T MAKE SENSE SO. I SPENT
THIRTY YEARS IN LAW ENFORCEMENT
EIGHTEEN YEARS THE MANAGER'S
SUPERVISOR. SLASH HE FILLED OUT
THE WORKERS COMP FORM. SENT A
MAN. IN DELPHIAN PLOIDY THAT
WERE AFFECTED BY IT SO I HAVE
A- LOT OF HISTORY THAT IN THAT.
IN IN TWO CASES NOT PARTICULAR
HERE. IN ONE INVOLVES WILL
NEVER TEAR THE CAPITAL SHE
SPENT TEN YEARS HERE. THE
GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND- LATER ON
BECAME A LOT FOR SMALL FOR THE
SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT. ISSUES
ABOVE WOMAN SHE WILK RECTAL
CANCER IN. TWO THOUSAND SEVEN.
AND IS CONSIDERED A PRESUMPTIVE
INJURY. ON DUTY INJURY TOOK
THIRTEEN YEARS. FOR THE CASE TO
BE SETTLED. WORKERS COMP KEPT
PUSHING HER CASE BACK WITH NO
CONCERN FOR DEADLINES. OR
HEALTH AND WELLBEING. SHE'S NOW
DEVELOPED IN THE FORM OF
CANCER. FOR IMMUNE SYSTEM WHICH
IS CURRENTLY IN HOSPITAL
RECEIVING TREATMENT. HER
ATTORNEY SAID. THERE'S WORKERS
COMP ISSUE ALTHOUGH SHE CHOSE
NOT TO PURSUE WORKERS COMP.
BECAUSE THEN THEY HAVE THE
STRENGTH TO FIGHT IT. SO IN THE
IN THE FIRST RECTAL. CANCER
CASE- TO THE COLOSTOMY BAG FOR
SHE CAME HERE. LAST YEAR'S
ASSUMING AND WE WERE ABLE TO
PUSH THE BALL FORWARD. IF I GET
THE CASE SETTLED. BUT THIRTEEN
YEARS. ANOTHER FEMALE OFFICER
FOR THE SECOND SHIFT PART IN
BOTH OF THEM. SUFFERED A
MASSIVE STROKE IN FEBRUARY OF
TWENTY THIRTEEN. THE CASE IS
STILL IN DISPUTE AS OF OCTOBER
OF LAST YEAR. SHE CONTINUES TO
SUFFERFROM APHASIA. AT THE
DISORDER FOR THAT RESULTS FROM
DAMAGE TO PORTIONS OF THE
BRAIN. RESPONSIBLE FOR
LANGUAGE. AND DYSPHAGIA.
DIFFICULTY SWALLOWING AND RIGHT
SIDE PARALYSIS. ANXIETY SHE WAS
NOT WORKERS COMP BENEFITS. AND
TOLD WAS. NOT REPLICATED EVEN
THOSE CONSIDERED PRESUMPTIVE ON
DUTY INJURY. SO YOU DO HAVE
CASES IN. YEAH QUITE A FEW
CASES. WHERE THE- WORKERS COMP.
DOESN'T APPROVE THIS CASE IN
THE PHOTO TESTIFY. FOR MINISTRY
NONE OF THEM. ACTUALLY WORK ON-
PHIL'S NOT UNCOMMON FOR THE
MIDDLE FOR A REGULAR- THESE TWO
OFFICERS ARE SWORN TO PROTECT
AND SERVE. EVERY DAY PUT THEIR
LIVES ON THE LINE AS DO OUR
FIREFIGHTERS YEAH WHEN THEY'RE
IN AND OUT OF A JOB OUR WORKERS
COMP SYSTEM FILL THE SERVE
THEM. ON THE WORKERS COMP
PERFECT NO. WORKERS CANNOT BE
IMPROVED YES. THIS BILL MAKES
IMPROVEMENTS TO ENSURE THE
STORIES THE AUTHOR STRUGGLING
OF FIREFIGHTERS. THE WORKERS
COMP SYSTEM IS REPEATED OVER
AND OVER AGAIN. BUT I BELIEVE
IT DOESN'T GO FAR ENOUGH FROM
IT DOESN'T MOVE THE NEEDLE
ENOUGH TO MAKE WORKERS COMP
LAY FAIR- SOMEONE TALKED ABOUT
IT BEING A GIFT A TAXPAYER
DOLLARS. YOUR OTHER PUTTING
YOUR LIFE ON THE LINE- WHEN
YOU'RE GOING IN AND DOING WHAT
WE SEE OUR LAW ENFORCEMENT DEAL
WITH OUR FIREFIGHTERS- NOW YOU
READ THE ARTICLES NOW TO TALK
ABOUT. WATCHING THE
FIREFIGHTERS TURNOUT GEAR
GOOGLE THE CAUSTIC CANCER
CAUSING CHEMICALS THEY BUILT ON
A DAILY BASIS. YEARS AGO THEY'D
HAVE THAT. SO YOU YOU SEE MORE
MORE FOR A LONG TIME BREAST
CANCER FOR WOMEN FIREFIGHTERS
WITH A CONSIDER PRESUMPTIVE.
THAT JUST CAME ABOUT SO IT'S A
SYSTEM WHERE YOU'RE ALWAYS
FIGHTING OVER AND OVER AND OVER
AGAIN. AND LIKE I SAID I KNOW A
LOT OF FIREFIGHTERS SIMILAR
STORIES. IN THERE FORCED TO
FIGHT AGAIN AND AGAIN AGAIN AND
CASES ARE DELAYED SO. THIS YET
WHO KEEP TRACK OF. CASES THE
COUNTY DOESN'T. WE'LL KEEP
TRACK OF CASES. THAT'S WORKERS
COMP RESPONSIBILITY TO KEEP
TRAFFIC AB DEF GENERAL TALK. TO
KEEP TRACK OF THE CASES. SO I
HEARD A LOT OF STATISTICS.
TALKED ABOUT HERE. I DON'T HAVE
ANY SPECIFIC FUND CASES PAID.
HELLO CASES TAKE FROM BEGINNING
TO END. IF YOU HAVE THAT
INFORMATION IT WOULD BE A
GREGIS. IT WOULD BE A GREGIS
FOR OUR FIREFIGHTERS AND OUR
PEACE OFFICERS. AND JUST A MIKE
IN MY THIRTY YEARS I SAW PLENTY
OF CASES BOTH WANT TO COME BACK
TO WORK BEFORE THE SHOULD BE
RETIRED AND WORKERS COMP DRAG
THEIR FEET. AND IT DID THE DAY
IT COMES DOWN TO MONEY. WE'RE
TALKING PRESUMPTIVE INJURIES
NOTHING ELSE PRESUMPTIVE IN
PARTICULAR HEART TACKED ON
DUTY- KOTEK PERIOD THAT'S
PRESUMPTIVE THAT'S THE LAW. IT
IS NOT BEING APPLIED THAT WAY
THE CANCER PRESUMPTIVE. SO HERE
TWO FEMALE OFFICERS I KNOW
PERSONALLY THAT HAVE WORKED FOR
ME. FIGHTING CASES WE'RE
TALKING FOR CASES FROM TWO
THOUSAND SEVEN THERE WERE JUST
RESULT LAST YEAR FOR RECTAL
CANCER THIS WILL WALK AROUND
THE COLOSTOMY BAG IN UNIFORM ON
DUTY. FOR THIRTEEN YEARS.
THAT'S NOT OKAY. ANOTHER
OFFICER WHO HAS TWO KIDS HER
HUSBAND IS A FULL TIME CARE
GIVER HE'S ALSO SERGEANTS
SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT HE CARES
FOR HER SHE GOT TWO SMALL
CHILDREN. HAD A HEART ATTACK.
SO LIKE I SAID. THERE'S BEEN A
LOT OF INVESTMENTS A LOT OF
CHANGES. IS NOT PERFECT BUT
LIKE I SAID. I MEAN I KNOW WE
KEEP ASKING FOR NUMBERS BUT- AT
SOME POINT SOMEONE GOT
RESPONSIBLE. YOU KNOW IN AND I
GUESS THE NUMBERS FOR THE FOR
THE MEMBERS. YOU KNOW
STRUGGLING WITH THIS.
MCCAFFREY'S OFFICE SOME POINT.
WHO'S GONNA KEEP TRACK OF THAT
THE CASES THAT HAVE BEEN
DELAYED AND DRAGGED ON THERE'S
A MECHANISM FOR THAT. AND
SOMETIMES IT BEHOOVES THE
WORKERS CAUGHT. FOLKS TO DRAG
THIS CASE WITHOUT BECAUSE
PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF FIGHTING
ARE YOU TYPING COURTNEY'S DRAGS
ON YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS
BECAUSE I WORK FOR COUNTY THEY
HAVE DEEP POCKETS THEY CONFIDED
FOREVER AND THEY DO THAT
SOMETIMES IT HAS GOT TO BE A
LOT OF CASES IT CAN BE JUST A
LIMIT NUMBER OF CASES BUT THE
FACT IS THAT HIS DRUG OUT. IN
IMPACT SOMEONE'S LIFE. SO I
DON'T BELIEVE WE'RE TALKING
ABOUT AYE AYE YOU MODEST
UNIVERSE. WE'RE TALKING YOU
KNOW HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF
PEOPLENO BUT HE'S CASES- IS
PERSON PLAN A BADGE AND MADE
THE COMMITMENT TO PROTECT AND
DEFEND- FOLKS OUT THERE AND
RESPOND MUST RUN THE BURNING
BUILDING- DEAL FOR THE BILL
WITH FIREMEN DO THAT IN MEN AND
WOMEN DO THAT RIGHT NOW. YOU
KNOW LAW ENFORCEMENT DEALS WITH
THAT RIGHT NOW. SO TO ME IT'S
NOT IT'S A SMALL PRICE TO PAY
AND- I'VE SEEN THIS FIRSTHAND.
I'M NOT. MAKING LIGHT OF IT
I'VE SEEN IT FIRSTHAND. IN
WORKERS COMP. DOES A LOT OF
GOOD SOMETIMES BUT SOMETIMES
JUST LIKE IT'S A NUMBERS THAT
THEY DON'T SEE THE PEOPLE
BEYOND THAT THEY'RE BEING
IMPACTED THEIR LIVES IN THEIR
FAMILY IT'S JUST A NUMBER AS
THE DOLLAR THING AND OBVIOUSLY
THEY'RE TRYING TO SAVE MONEY.
IN THESE WORKERS COMP CASES.
THAT'S THAT'S THE REAL FACT
IT'S AN ISSUE IT IS A BUSINESS.
AND WE KNOW HOW BUSINESS WORKS
SOMETIMES NOT ALL BUSINESS IS
BAD BUT YOU'RE DEALING WITH
PEOPLE'S LIVES AND THEIR
LIVELIHOODS AND THEIR FAMILIES
SO. IT SOMETHING'S GONNA HAPPEN
HERE YOU KNOW AND- I'M SPEAKING
FROM THE HEART HERE. AND WE
NOTICED ON THIS W. AS IN HER
LAST YEAR WITH A COLOSTOMY BAG.
YOU KNOW AT SUGGEST YOU KNOW
SO- I HAVE A LOT OF RESPECT FOR
MY CHAIR- I RESPECT THE HELL
OUT OF THEM. AMBER THIS IS
SOMETHING FROM PERSONAL
EXPERIENCE THAT I JUST GOT A- I
CAN'T I CAN'T GO FOR THE
MINUTES ON THIS AND SO- AT THE
OF STILL WORK TO BE DONE ON
THIS BUT YEAH. IT IS WE'VE GOT
TO DO BETTER AND WE SHOULD DO
BETTER FOR THESE MEN AND WOMEN.
THANK YOU MISTER COOPER AND- I
THANK EVERYONE ON THE COMMITTEE
KNOWS I HAVE ENORMOUS RESPECT
FOR YOU- ENORMOUS RESPECT FOR
YOU THE- OVERRIDING. CONCEPT
HERE IS THAT THIS COMMITTEE AND
THE FULL ASSEMBLY AND THE FULL
STATE SENATE WILL BE DEALING
WITH WORKERS COMP REFORM THE
DAY IS GETTING CLOSER- WE'RE
WAITING FOR A SIGNAL FROM THE
GOVERNOR. I BELIEVE IF THE
ISSUES ARE S. PRESSING AS WE'VE
HEARD TODAY. FOR FIREFIGHTERS.
AND I'M SURE OTHER PARTIES WHO
WILL WANT TO BE AT THE TABLE
HAVE THEIR OWN PRESSING ISSUES
AS WELL CITIES COUNTIES- AS MR
COOLEY REMINDED US SOME
COUNTIES ARE SELF SELF FUNDED.
AND SO WE'LL BE DEALING WITH
THIS. VERY VERY DIFFICULT
SUBJECT BUT WILL BE LIVING WITH
WORKERS COMP REFORM IN THE
COMING MONTHS AND YEARS- I
THINK IN JERRY BROWN'S EIGHT
YEAR. MOST RECENT EIGHT YEARS
HE TACKLED WORKERS COMP REFORM
IN THE IN HIS FIRST TERM-
SCHWARZENEGGER'S YEARS IDEA I'M
NOT SURE AT WHAT POINT IT WAS
TACKLED BUT IT WILL BE TACKLED
AGAIN IN THE IN THE NEAR FUTURE.
AND WILL HAVE A CHANCE TO GET
TO HAVE BETTER DATA. AND ALL
PARTIES AT THE TABLE- THEY'LL
BE ALLOWED TO HEAD BANG AND I'M
SURE BUT AT LEAST. EVERYONE
WILL BE AT THE TABLE- AND-
OTHER MEMBERS OF LABOR TO BY
THE WAY LABOR BUSINESS LOCAL
GOVERNMENT. HEALTH DISTRICTS
EVERYONE WHO DEALS WITH IN
WORKERS COMP SO I THINK WE'VE
ALL THE- HEARD ENOUGH. MISTER
RODRIGUEZ. TECH RESEARCHER
MEMBERS YOU'RE NOT LITERALLY
GONNA SAY MUCH BUT AFTER JUST
HEARING THE DISCUSSIONS AND
FROM ALL BOTH SIDES AND CURRENT
LOOKING BACK ON MY EXPERIENCE
OF THIS YOU KNOW WORKING WITH
THE FIRST RESPONDERS FOR OVER
THIRTY YEARS- AS AN EMT AND
HEARING THE STORIES FROM BOTH A
POLICE OFFICERS AND
FIREFIGHTERS WHO TO THIS DAY
ARE STILL GOOD FRIENDS OF MINE.
AND MANY STORIES COME TO MIND
IN PARTICULAR- FIREFIGHTER GOOD
FRIEND OF MINE WHO JUST
RECENTLY RETIRED. WHO TELLS ME
NOT FREDDIE AYE I JUST RETIRED
AND I DON'T EVEN THINK ALL LAST
TEN YEARS FIVE YEAR FOR FIVE
YEARS OF A MONKEY. BECAUSE OF
ALL THE STUFF EVERY THEN RIGHT
GOING TO THE HOUSE FIRES CAR
FIRES AND ALTHOUGH THE
STRESSES. OF THE JOB RINGS ON
YOU WORKING TWENTY FOUR HOUR
SHIFTS WAKING UP IN THE MIDDLE
OF THE NIGHT FROM A DEAD SLEEP.
RIGHT THE STRESS OF THE PUTS ON
YOUR BODY YOUR HEART IN OTHER
THERE'S A LOT OF INCIDENTS WITH
WITH HEART ATTACKS AS WELL-
COMES TO MIND THAT YOU KNOW WE
NEED TO DO A LOT TO PROTECT OUR
FIRST RESPONDERS BECAUSE ALL
THE- ALL THE HARD WORK THEY DO
THAT. I DON'T THINK REALIZE
UNLESS WERE IN THEIR SHOES
RIGHT WORKING THE SHIFTS
WHETHER THE TWENTY FOUR HOUR
SHIFTS OR- WHEN LAW ENFORCEMENT
WORKING THAT NIGHT SHIFT- LIKE
MY SON LOVES YOU THINK SOME OF
YOU KNOW. MY SON IS A DEPUTY
OVER AN L. A. COUNTY IN THE
STRESSES HE DEALS WITH MORE SO
NOW THAN EVER BEFORE. I'M
TALKING. THE NORM COLLEAGUES
TALK ABOUT YOU KNOW SOME OF
THESE CASES. LASTING TEN YEARS
OR SO WORK BECOMES A MIND. MY
MOTHER IN LAW SHE RETIRED FROM
THE- PHARMACOLOGIC- OVER A BACK
INJURY AND WHATNOT AND- YOU
KNOW IT'S BEEN ALMOST TWENTY
YEARS SHE'S STILL FIGHTING HER
CASE. AND THE SITE THE TOLD ME
THERE'S AN ISSUE HERE. THERE'S
ISSUE HERE THAT- NEED TO BE
RESOLVED I KNOW IT'S A IT PUTS
ME VERY DIFFICULT SPOT RIGHT
BECAUSE I CAN KIND OF SEE BOTH
SIDES OF THE CONCERNS AND
ISSUES- WE NEED OF THE MOST
IMPORTANT THING IS COME TO
CONCLUSIONS SOONER RATHER THAN
LATER. HOW TO PROTECT THESE
WORKERS YOU KNOW BEING CHAIR OF
EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT A NEW
COMMITTEE THIS YEAR HAS REALLY
PUT ME IN A DIFFERENT
PERSPECTIVE OF THINGS MAKING
SURE THAT OUR FIRST RESPONDERS
OUT OF- THE NECESSARY EDUCATION
AND TRAINING AND EQUIPMENT TO
DO THEIR JOB. TO PROVIDE SAFETY
FOR US IN CALIFORNIA BUT ALSO
WE GOT A LOOK AT PROTECTING
THEM AS WELL IF THEY GET HURT
OR INJURED ALL WHILE DOING
THEIR JOB SO IT'S VERY TOUGH
IT'S DIFFICULT BUT I THINK- THE
STORIES I HEAR FROM FOLKS- WE
GOTTA DO A BETTER JOB OF TAKING
CARE OF THEM RESOLVING THE
ISSUES- BUT THEN AGAIN LIKE I
SAID I KNOW WE GO BACK AND
FORTH REGARDING. THE CAPS IN
THE MOUNTAIN AND I WISH WE HAD
MORE TIME RIGHT BECAUSE I THINK
IT NEEDS A LITTLE BIT MORE TIME
TO. TO COME TO A BETTER SENSE
BUT I THINK OF FOR ME I GOTTA
GO WITH MY GUT FEELING WE HAVE
TO PROTECT OUR FIRST OUR FIRST
RESPONDERS AND WHAT WE COUNCIL.
I'M LEANING TOWARDS TOWARDS
SUPPORTING THE BILL AS IT IS SO
I JUST WANNA SHOWS CONCERNED
WITH E AS WELL. THANK YOU
THANK YOU VERY MUCH. MR RUDD.
AND I THINK WE'VE EVERYONE'S
HAD A CHANCE TO TALK IN TO ASK
QUESTIONS AND SO. LET'S GO
AHEAD NOW ADDRESS THE MOTION
IT'S ON THE FLOOR MISTER MAZES
MOTION SECONDED BY MR COOLEY.
YEAH IN MID SENATOR CORTEZ CO
YOU MAY WANT TO CLOSE AT THIS
POINT TO- WITH YOUR
PRESENTATION. THANK YOU AGAIN
MR TERRIBLY APPRECIATE THE
CREATING THE OPPORTUNITY HERE
FOR ROBUST THE DISCUSSION AND
AGAIN ALL THE WORK THAT YOU'VE
DONE GOING BACK AND FORTH WITH
ME TO TRY TO ARRIVE AT A AT A
AT A GOOD LANDING SPOT AS I
SAID EARLIER- A BECAUSE OF. OF
DISAGREEMENT ON A MEMBER THREE.
OF I'M NOT SUPPORTIVE OF THE
MOTION ON THE FLOOR- OBVIOUSLY
I WOULD'VE BEEN A HOPEFUL OF
PHONE. A DIFFERENT MOTION OR AN
ALTERNATE MOTION OR SUBSTITUTE
MOTION OR WHATEVER PROCEDURE
pSAID- WHITE- RESPECT THE LONG
TERM REFORM THAT'S NEEDED IN
THIS AREA. I THINK OF WHAT
WE'VE HEARD WHAT I UNDERSTAND
TO BE THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE.
MUCH MORE DATA AT ALL. IS THAT
THE SYSTEM IS NOT JUST. NOW
AND- JUSTICE DELAYED IS JUSTICE
DENIED. HER SO YES I AM IN A
HURRY TO FIX THIS PIECE OF THE
SYSTEM. AND WOULD LIKE TO GET
TO THAT- AGAIN I'VE EVER.
RESPECTFULLY- I REQUEST YOU FOR
THE CONSIDERATION THANK YOU.
THANK YOU SENATOR- YOU BROUGHT
US A TOUGH BILL AND- WE SPENT A
LOT OF TIME ON IT AND I THINK
WE'VE- WE'VE LEARNED A LOT
WE'VE ALL LEARNED A LOT ABOUT
TO. THE CURRENT SYSTEM IN. AND
NOW WHAT REFORMS MAY BE COMING
IN MAY BE NECESSARY SO LET'S A
GO AHEAD AND DO A ROLL CALL
VOTE ON THE MOTION THAT'S ON
THE FLOOR WHICH- ADOPTS THE FOR
AMENDMENTS THAT ARE IN THE
COMMITTEE ANALYSIS. SB THREE
THREE FIVE MOTION IS DUE PASSED
AS AMENDED AS PROPOSED IN THE.
MAYES AYE BERMAN. BERMAN AYE
BIGELOW CALDERON. CHEN CHEN NOT
VOTING COOLEY FIVE COOLEY AYE
COOPER. COOPER NOT VOTING
FRAZIER FRAZIER AYE GIPSON.
GIPSON AYE GRAYSON GRAYSON AYE
RODRIGUEZ. RODRIGUEZ NOT VOTING
VOEPEL. VOEPEL NOT VOTING WOULD.
NO WOULD NOT VOTING. SEVEN DID
YOU ANNOUNCE IT PLEASE. THAT
THIS BILL HAS SEVEN VOTES SO
THERE SEVEN OUR VOTES- WITH THE
REST OF STANCHIONS- MR MAYS
ANIYA ANY COMMENTS OR THOUGHTS
ABOUT. THE MOTION MISTER
BIGELOW HAS RETURNED. MISTER
BIGELOW WE JUST DID A ROLL CALL
VOTE ON THE ON MISTER MAZES
MOTION. GO IN GO AHEAD AND VOTE
MR BIGELOW IF YOU'RE READY
BIGELOW NOT VOTING. ALL RIGHT.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.
ALL RIGHT. HEARINGS CLOSED.
THANK YOU MISTER. YEAH.